Does anyone feel Classic is the weakest Season?

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Stormness_1

Lapis Lunaris
Oct 18, 2015
17
0
0
#41
I love classic as well.. I can remember the first time watching it, and as a child being amazed that 'Serena' and 'Darien' were actually meant to be.. After that I vowed I'd find my tuxedo mask, and well I actually did without realizing it! He doesn't wear a tux (except for our wedding), and isn't a prince, but his birthday is August third, and he's tall, dark and handsome, with blue eyes and is corny as heck, a little girl magnet (our nieces freaking ADORE him!) and the most romantic guy, always surprising me with a single red rose, and sweet little things he says.. Anyway I like classic best!
 

Black Scythe

Lapis Lunaris
Mar 26, 2015
56
0
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#42
I actually really disagree and think the first season was one of the strongest. As many people before me have stated that it was our introduction into Sailor Moon and anime in general, and without it the other seasons wouldn't have existed. Now.. Most people who may know me are probably aware that I am a serious nostalgia freak. So for me Sailor Moon was a massive part of my childhood and still is a big part of my life. It was my introduction into the anime world. Now I was pretty young when I got into Sailor Moon and anime, so I didn't really know of manga until I was quite older and I'm sure a lot of people may have been the same. Cartoons were quite engaging for me as a young one and I loved them. So again, Sailor Moon was big for me. And I'm glad I got into it because now I can appreciate it for what it is. Sure it has it's flaws, the original English dub will always be my favourite, despite it's many, many flaws. But again I can look back and really appreciate what it is. And again, without it we wouldn't have had the rest of the seasons, and for sure not the comeback it's making today with everything being re released. It gives me a chance now that I'm older and have my own job to start my own collection! So I have a lot to thank for of the first season. Season R, S and StarS are my favourites in that order. SuperS being my least. I'm currently trying to watch it now and I am really struggling. I can watch 2 episodes and then I break for a couple of weeks, up to a month. The other seasons I can just fly through. So yeah. Just my two cents. I love Sailor Moon. Haha.
 

Boro

Lapis Lunaris
May 19, 2012
2,678
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Mount Grimrock Level 4
#43
Classic was probably the strongest:
It had the most subplots, plus the writers actually remembered those subplots time to time.
It had secondary characters, and the inner senshi were marginally less useless than in other seasons.
+1: The writers actually knew what they wanted to do with Tuxedo Mask's character (and they swiftly ran out of ideas after the season ended)

personally
I also dig the Fae court theme of the Dark Kingdom/Realm, and both some of the early Usagi solo episodes, and the trio dynamic of Moon, Mercury and Mars.

Oh, and there is also the disguise pen.
 

leanpox

Lapis Lunaris
Oct 18, 2015
1
0
0
#44
I grew up on Sailor Moon too, but I'm rewatching the series on Hulu and you can really see how weak both Classic and R are. The amount of filler is so excessive and it kills the momentum of every actual plot development (no idea what people are talking about when they say it has good pacing). Not to mention that huge important developments are glossed over or rushed, right after a string of like 4-5 pointless filler episodes. Oh, we need to reveal the Silver Millennium backstory before Beryl is defeated?? BEGONIA we don't have enough time left for them to actually travel to the moon and hear it all. Umm let's just have Kunzite send them to another dimension or something, yeah that will totally work. Kunzite's attack conveniently sent them all to the moon to learn about their past lives! Wow, so helpful, thanks Kunzite!!! and other stupid stuff like that.

Once you hit S, you can immediately tell that it's better, better animation, better story, better direction (thanks Ikuhara) and overall respects its audience's time a bit more. Still lots of stupid filler, but when Classic set up a successful Scooby Doo formula I guess you gotta stick with it to sell toys.

Classic isn't terrible but it definitely has major flaws, and just because it's the first season and established the rest of the series doesn't mean it necessarily has to be the best or even good. I'd probably rate it about evenly with SuperS.


[edited by knm for language]
 

Neon Genesis

Luna Crescens
Oct 31, 2015
2,332
237
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#47
Hi, I'm new here and this is officially my first post! I wouldn't say the first season is my favorite but I don't think it's the weakest and I think it holds up really well as a strong story. I think what I love about the first season the most is how well balanced it is. I think it has the best balance of action, comedy, romance, and tragedy and it never feels like it's over-emphasizing one over the other. I also think it has the best balance of character development for all the characters. Almost everyone seems to get their own subplots and background development, even Naru and Umino get a subplot, whereas with later seasons it feels like they focus too much on Usagi or too much on the Starlights. But in the first season all the Sailor Guardians have their own background episodes, even Venus who has one of the most tragic background episodes in the anime. The Shittennou are classic bad guys you care about and even cry over. I've seen the ending to the first season countless number of times and I still cry no matter how many times you watch it. How many series out there can you think of when they
Spoiler: show
kill the main characters at the end of the first season?
Even in anime, this kind of ending still seems rather rare and I think the first season pulled it off really well. Personally I really liked the filler in episodes in this season and I thought they were actually really unique and like they were trying different ideas. Like the episode where Usagi helps save the jazz musician is still a great example of a filler in episode done well to me.

I think the biggest problem I have with the first season is I thought they portrayed Usagi and Mamoru's relationship rather poorly. I don't like they made Mamoru a jerk all the time. Like at one point Mamoru called the guy Usagi had a crush on a loser which is something he would never do in any of the other adaptations of Sailor Moon. Classic also made it seem like the only reason Usagi and Mamoru were in love with each other was because of destiny to the point that even in the Doom Tree arc, they had that babysitting episode where Usagi started doubting if she and Mamoru were compatible with each other outside of destiny. I thought the manga did a much better job of making Mamoru a more interesting character and making you actually believe in their romance and I didn't like how the anime seemed to tone down Beryl's unrequited feelings for Mamoru and made her a more generic villain, especially with how well done they handled the Shittenou. I can also see how it can be a bit slow starting for some fans at the beginning where it's just Usagi doing goofy things like trying to lose weight or winning a talent show or something. But I think when Classic is at its best the feels always stay with you and I think it still holds up as solid entertainment years later.
 

MariaTenebre

Luna Crescens
Jul 22, 2009
4,858
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#48
Neon Genesis said:
Hi, I'm new here and this is officially my first post! I wouldn't say the first season is my favorite but I don't think it's the weakest and I think it holds up really well as a strong story. I think what I love about the first season the most is how well balanced it is. I think it has the best balance of action, comedy, romance, and tragedy and it never feels like it's over-emphasizing one over the other. I also think it has the best balance of character development for all the characters. Almost everyone seems to get their own subplots and background development, even Naru and Umino get a subplot, whereas with later seasons it feels like they focus too much on Usagi or too much on the Starlights. But in the first season all the Sailor Guardians have their own background episodes, even Venus who has one of the most tragic background episodes in the anime. The Shittennou are classic bad guys you care about and even cry over. I've seen the ending to the first season countless number of times and I still cry no matter how many times you watch it. How many series out there can you think of when they
Spoiler: show
kill the main characters at the end of the first season?
Even in anime, this kind of ending still seems rather rare and I think the first season pulled it off really well. Personally I really liked the filler in episodes in this season and I thought they were actually really unique and like they were trying different ideas. Like the episode where Usagi helps save the jazz musician is still a great example of a filler in episode done well to me.

I think the biggest problem I have with the first season is I thought they portrayed Usagi and Mamoru's relationship rather poorly. I don't like they made Mamoru a jerk all the time. Like at one point Mamoru called the guy Usagi had a crush on a loser which is something he would never do in any of the other adaptations of Sailor Moon. Classic also made it seem like the only reason Usagi and Mamoru were in love with each other was because of destiny to the point that even in the Doom Tree arc, they had that babysitting episode where Usagi started doubting if she and Mamoru were compatible with each other outside of destiny. I thought the manga did a much better job of making Mamoru a more interesting character and making you actually believe in their romance and I didn't like how the anime seemed to tone down Beryl's unrequited feelings for Mamoru and made her a more generic villain, especially with how well done they handled the Shittenou. I can also see how it can be a bit slow starting for some fans at the beginning where it's just Usagi doing goofy things like trying to lose weight or winning a talent show or something. But I think when Classic is at its best the feels always stay with you and I think it still holds up as solid entertainment years later.
Honestly I don't think they portrayed Usagi and Mamoru's relationship very badly. Yes Mamoru could be jerky but so could Usagi as well. Really they were like too immature children who were mean to one another because they didn't know how to show that they liked one another. This dynamic has been done on so many shows. It was done on Wedding Peach with Momoko and Yousuke. I mean seriously watch Wedding Peach the show is very similar to Sailor Moon. Momoko and Yousuke both start out bickering and fighting when they really like each other. Momoko even pretty much acts exactly like Usagi and Yousuke acts like a more immature and less reserved Mamoru. It was also done on Inuyasha with Inuyasha and Kagome. The two are practically constantly at each other's throats when they really like one another. Also Classic didn't make it seem like they only loved each other for destiny because even on the show the two become closer to each other without destiny. Like the art episode and the episode right when they found out their identities, they warm up to each other even before knowing their identities and even engage in flirting. Plus the two became close to each other as well when they were Sailor Moon and Tuxedo Mask having many romantic moments. Also aside from that one moment the Makaiju arc showed how compatible and close Mamoru and Usagi got without the aid of memories. At the end of the babysitting episode the two bonded, worked together and showed their closeness and attraction. However I do agree that the manga did the romance in the first season better in some respects. Like for instance I liked in the manga how they found out their identities before they got their memories back, before Venus even came in. Also I agree that I wish they had given more insight and time to Beryl's past but her unrequited love was still there. It was basically stated that Beryl joined up with Metaria and went against the Moon Kingdom because of her love for Endymion. I would have still liked some flashbacks to maybe before Beryl joined with Metaria like in the manga however on the most part I agree with your other statements. I agree that I loved how they gave so many subplots to the characters even minor characters like Naru and Umino. I loved they gave the Shitennou personalities and development and made them actual characters. I also loved that they gave Ami and Rei possible love interests with Urawa and Yuuichirou.
 

Neon Genesis

Luna Crescens
Oct 31, 2015
2,332
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#49
Yes, the love/hate relationship theme is a common trope in fiction but there are also other anime shows I felt like did it better like Cardcaptor Sakura and Escaflowne though personally I feel like this trope is a bit over-rated and it'd be nice for the girl to get a guy that actually treats her with respect in fiction for a change but I guess writers must think this is an easier way to create unnecessary drama or something. Usagi can be mean to Mamoru too like in the Princess Dream episode but at least in Usagi's case, she has the excuse of being an immature 14 year old girl whereas the original anime made Mamoru a college student for some reason. And a college guy going around stalking a 14 year old and telling her the guy she likes is a loser just doesn't sit right with me. Yes, Usagi and Mamoru do start to be nicer to each other for like two whole episodes before they find out about their past but it's nowhere close to the full blown romance they suddenly have with each other after they find out about their destiny. Perhaps I would have thought it was better developed if they started showing them be more closer to each other at the start of the Rainbow Crystal arc instead of waiting until two episodes before the big reveal. But in the manga, Mamoru seems to become more interested in Usagi as a person right away at the beginning of the series when he starts suspecting Usagi is Sailor Moon. Even when he teases her in the manga, it's a much more gentler teasing, like the way a big brother would tease his little sister than the outright nasty way Mamoru was in the 90s show. Likewise Usagi starts becoming more interested in Mamoru in the manga when she finds out he's Tuxedo Mask though Makoto suspects Usagi might like him more than she lets on before then. I also think the manga does a better job of establishing that Usagi and the Princess are two different people than the 90s anime did. With the 90s anime it was like destiny wanted Usagi and Mamoru to be together and face their trials together and Usagi even cites destiny as the reason for their relationship in the breakup episode of R. In contrast, with the manga it seems like it's the opposite and destiny is actually trying to keep Usagi and Mamoru apart because their relationship was forbidden in the Moon Kingdom but Usagi and Mamoru love each other so much they're willing to defy their destines and accept whatever tragedy might fall on them because of it and I think that's a much stronger story to me in the manga.
 

MariaTenebre

Luna Crescens
Jul 22, 2009
4,858
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#50
Neon Genesis said:
Yes, the love/hate relationship theme is a common trope in fiction but there are also other anime shows I felt like did it better like Cardcaptor Sakura and Escaflowne though personally I feel like this trope is a bit over-rated and it'd be nice for the girl to get a guy that actually treats her with respect in fiction for a change but I guess writers must think this is an easier way to create unnecessary drama or something. Usagi can be mean to Mamoru too like in the Princess Dream episode but at least in Usagi's case, she has the excuse of being an immature 14 year old girl whereas the original anime made Mamoru a college student for some reason. And a college guy going around stalking a 14 year old and telling her the guy she likes is a loser just doesn't sit right with me. Yes, Usagi and Mamoru do start to be nicer to each other for like two whole episodes before they find out about their past but it's nowhere close to the full blown romance they suddenly have with each other after they find out about their destiny. Perhaps I would have thought it was better developed if they started showing them be more closer to each other at the start of the Rainbow Crystal arc instead of waiting until two episodes before the big reveal. But in the manga, Mamoru seems to become more interested in Usagi as a person right away at the beginning of the series when he starts suspecting Usagi is Sailor Moon. Even when he teases her in the manga, it's a much more gentler teasing, like the way a big brother would tease his little sister than the outright nasty way Mamoru was in the 90s show. Likewise Usagi starts becoming more interested in Mamoru in the manga when she finds out he's Tuxedo Mask though Makoto suspects Usagi might like him more than she lets on before then. I also think the manga does a better job of establishing that Usagi and the Princess are two different people than the 90s anime did. With the 90s anime it was like destiny wanted Usagi and Mamoru to be together and face their trials together and Usagi even cites destiny as the reason for their relationship in the breakup episode of R. In contrast, with the manga it seems like it's the opposite and destiny is actually trying to keep Usagi and Mamoru apart because their relationship was forbidden in the Moon Kingdom but Usagi and Mamoru love each other so much they're willing to defy their destines and accept whatever tragedy might fall on them because of it and I think that's a much stronger story to me in the manga.
Well even though Mamoru is a college student you must remember that after his parents died he was alone for a good portion of his life and has next to no social skills. Usagi was one of the first people he truly let in and showed his feelings to her. Also they did become closer around that art episode and the two go from teasing each other in a mean way to a more playful way although I wish that we could have seen them become even more closer early on although I believe even in the manga they were still just as mean to each other as in the anime although they became closer more quickly. Plus in the anime as well alot of people think that Usagi and Mamoru like each other they are just being kiddish with their feelings. I do have to disagree with you on one thing. Usagi and Princess Serenity are the same person. In the manga it was shown that Serenity was just as silly, flighty and childish as Usagi was. I also think that in the anime as well that destiny tries to keep them apart as well as they face numerous obstacles that try to separate them but they always come back to each other. However I do in general agree that the manga did some better things with their romance but I still think the 90s anime did a good job.
 

Neon Genesis

Luna Crescens
Oct 31, 2015
2,332
237
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#51
I'm not sure it can be claimed that Mamoru is as mean in the manga as he is in the 90s anime. The worst scene in the manga is that Mamoru tells Usagi her grades are bad and she needs to study. In comparison, you have 90s Mamoru butting into Usagi's conversations with Motoki to crush her dreams by telling her she has zero chance of being a model when she didn't ask for his opinion. And it seems clear to me the manga is trying to portray Usagi and Serenity as different people. There's even a whole Act where Usagi is concerned she's becoming more like the Princess and the Inners have to reaffirm to her that she's her own person and she doesn't have to follow the same path of the Princess just because she's the reincarnation of the Princess.
 

MariaTenebre

Luna Crescens
Jul 22, 2009
4,858
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#52
Neon Genesis said:
I'm not sure it can be claimed that Mamoru is as mean in the manga as he is in the 90s anime. The worst scene in the manga is that Mamoru tells Usagi her grades are bad and she needs to study. In comparison, you have 90s Mamoru butting into Usagi's conversations with Motoki to crush her dreams by telling her she has zero chance of being a model when she didn't ask for his opinion. And it seems clear to me the manga is trying to portray Usagi and Serenity as different people. There's even a whole Act where Usagi is concerned she's becoming more like the Princess and the Inners have to reaffirm to her that she's her own person and she doesn't have to follow the same path of the Princess just because she's the reincarnation of the Princess.
They are definitely the same person in flashbacks to the Silver Millennium Princess Serenity is portrayed as being just as flighty, silly and childish as Usagi like how she skips out on her lessons to go to Earth and was even shown to be a crybaby as well. Also she may not have to follow the same path as the princess but she definitely is the same as the Princess.

Also back to Mamoru I believe he was just as mean to her in the manga. Both in the manga had scenes where they were arguing with each other and in the manga it honestly seemed like Usagi was more of the aggressor. However either way it all goes back to that trope you and I mentioned. Also while Mamoru and Usagi could be mean to each other honestly Mamoru was no more meaner to Usagi then Rei was to Usagi and in fact they bonded over their teasing of Usagi. It probably isn't coincidental that Mamoru is the man she loves and Rei is her best friend because in real life sometimes the people you fight with the most are the people you are closest too. I mean take for example me and my brother. We sometimes have bad fights but at the same time we are very close.
 
May 1, 2015
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Pikari-gaoka
sparklyheartsdiana.tumblr.com
#54
leanpox said:
I grew up on Sailor Moon too, but I'm rewatching the series on Hulu and you can really see how weak both Classic and R are. The amount of filler is so excessive and it kills the momentum of every actual plot development (no idea what people are talking about when they say it has good pacing). Not to mention that huge important developments are glossed over or rushed, right after a string of like 4-5 pointless filler episodes. Oh, we need to reveal the Silver Millennium backstory before Beryl is defeated?? BEGONIA we don't have enough time left for them to actually travel to the moon and hear it all. Umm let's just have Kunzite send them to another dimension or something, yeah that will totally work. Kunzite's attack conveniently sent them all to the moon to learn about their past lives! Wow, so helpful, thanks Kunzite!!! and other stupid stuff like that.

Once you hit S, you can immediately tell that it's better, better animation, better story, better direction (thanks Ikuhara) and overall respects its audience's time a bit more. Still lots of stupid filler, but when Classic set up a successful Scooby Doo formula I guess you gotta stick with it to sell toys.

Classic isn't terrible but it definitely has major flaws, and just because it's the first season and established the rest of the series doesn't mean it necessarily has to be the best or even good. I'd probably rate it about evenly with SuperS.


[edited by knm for language]

Excuse me, what is it about the fillers about that annoyed you? I personally loved MOST of the fillers.
 

Kerochan no Miko

Knight Radiant
Staff member
Site Admin
Feb 29, 2004
6,242
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#55
FifthDoctorVenus said:
Excuse me, what makes you think the fillers are stupid and pointless? I personally loved the fillers.
Let's sing a little song called "Not Everyone Likes The Same Things That I Like".

Considering that there's an entire thread discussing whether or not people liked the filler episodes, I'd say opinions are decidedly mixed. And that's okay~!
 

Scwatk01

Lapis Lunaris
May 13, 2015
163
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Louisville
#56
Like most people already said here, I agree that Classic is definitely not the weakest season. If anything, it set up the whole pattern of what each season after it would be like. You have an enemy that causes havoc amongst Tokyo. The enemy is searching for some type of item that'll help them destroy the world, they send out their "henchmen" or people who work with them who then send out monsters to target certain people, the Senshi and Sailor Moon find out what's going on and Sailor Moon kills said monster and then everything goes back to normal. The Classic season helped boost Sailor Moon into popularity as well. Without it, there would be no Sailor Moon. Now, the weakest season in my honest opinion would have to be SuperS. Although I kinda like SuperS and grew up watching it, I feel it lacked a lot compared to the other seasons. Too much comedy, too much Chibiusa, and not of enough relativity to the Dream Arc from the manga. I just feel TOEI could've done a lot better with that season and Stars.
 
Sep 6, 2014
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#57
I thought it was the best. R had the asinine break-up, S and SuperS I really hated the pure heart crystals and dream mirrors concepts. Stars basically rehashes from the first three seasons.
 
Aug 16, 2014
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#58
LifeGaveMeLemons said:
I thought it was the best. R had the asinine break-up, S and SuperS I really hated the pure heart crystals and dream mirrors concepts. Stars basically rehashes from the first three seasons.
Preety much agree,the first season was the best. The last seasons Stars was more like a rehash.
 
Sep 17, 2014
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Eternity
#59
Not weakest or strongest, but It was the one with integrity, I mean giving the feel of a complete story. (Naoko already stated she was going to stop there as everybody knows) So I was able to condonate all the unnecessary gum-longing fillers, also senshi were too new with their duty. Repeat of these aspects didn't help at later seasons tho.
If a story would even make a dull man like me emotinal I can't call it weak. Sad that classic's heart catching slowly disappeared at later seasons.
 
Nov 14, 2015
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High Earth Orbit
#60
Second favorite for me after R. For the most part it is paced really well (I love the rainbow crystal arc!) but I thought it slowed down after the big plot reveal trilogy at the end of Zoicite's arc. I strongly disliked the last bunch of episodes (save one or two exceptions, like Minako's backstory ep) though the finale was great.

There is some great stuff from the manga and Crystal that didn't make it into the original anime. Beryl as sympathetic villain was beautiful and I wish the show had explored the idea of her love for Endymion being used to corrupt her more.