Is SMC really that similar to the manga?

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Mar 8, 2012
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#21
Phobos and Deimos have appeared in Crystal, though. They were in Act 3 and I think they've appeared briefly in another episode, but for the most part they've been forgotten about/ignored/non-characters. (Which is more or less the case in the manga as well.)
 

MariaTenebre

Luna Crescens
Jul 22, 2009
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#22
See with regards to Phobos and Deimos I always wished that they were really set up as Sailor Mars's Guardian animals from the beginning. If I had done it I would have them to be able to talk from the beginning and even be the ones to give Rei her transformation pen instead of Luna.

I will say one thing I am excited to see in Crystal with regards to this duo is finally seeing which one is which of the two. To quote wikimoon.

Phobos and Deimos were almost identical in their humanoid forms, with the only difference being the color of their clothing. However, in the artbook Original Picture Collection Volume IV, Phobos was in the purple clothing and Deimos in red, but in Original Picture Collection Volume V, the colors were reversed. Since the manga pages were black and white, it is therefore impossible to know which one is actually which.

http://wikimoon.org/index.php?title=Phobos

I still think it is ridiculous for Naoko Takeuchi to be so inconsistent in the colors of both of them and labeling who is who.
 

doctorwho29

Lapis Lunaris
Sep 29, 2014
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#23
MariaTenebre said:
See with regards to Phobos and Deimos I always wished that they were really set up as Sailor Mars's Guardian animals from the beginning. If I had done it I would have them to be able to talk from the beginning and even be the ones to give Rei her transformation pen instead of Luna.

I will say one thing I am excited to see in Crystal with regards to this duo is finally seeing which one is which of the two. To quote wikimoon.

Phobos and Deimos were almost identical in their humanoid forms, with the only difference being the color of their clothing. However, in the artbook Original Picture Collection Volume IV, Phobos was in the purple clothing and Deimos in red, but in Original Picture Collection Volume V, the colors were reversed. Since the manga pages were black and white, it is therefore impossible to know which one is actually which.

http://wikimoon.org/index.php?title=Phobos

I still think it is ridiculous for Naoko Takeuchi to be so inconsistent in the colors of both of them and labeling who is who.
Once when I was trying to come up with my own reboot of Sailor Moon, I was going to have the crows give her the pen. Not in their human forms but they'd drop a feather or two that would become the pen. i came up with unique ways for all to get their items but I'm a little fuzzy on what I was going to do with Ami and Mako. Ami I think I was going to use a pen her father had given her once and it transforms when she awakens. Mako, I really don't remember my ideas lol
 
May 31, 2009
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#24
On a visual level, when Crystal tries to replicate a scene from the manga the end result feels very different to me even though they are technically similar.

I see a panel from the manga and it's appealing, and artistic, and atmospheric, and the characters are emoting properly, and you get the relationship between two characters just by the subtle way they gaze at each other. And then I see a screencap of Crystal recreating the same panel and there's nothing there and I'm just...




Is anyone else experiencing this?
 
Mar 8, 2012
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#25
Every. Single. Time. It always just ends up looking like mediocre fan art. Crystal would be better off not trying to replicate the manga panel-by-panel but it continues to be its own worst enemy.
 

Echelon9

Luna Nova
Aug 18, 2011
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#26
Crystal isn't an exact duplicate of the manga; no. But it is much more faithful to the source material than the original anime was. All things considered, I have been pleased with Crystal. I had my gripes in the first season, but I thought seasons 2 and 3 were well done. With season 3 in particular showing improvements in the art and animation quality. People can nitpick all they want, sure. Lots of things could have been improved. But no adaption is perfect. Even FMA:B, which is widely regarded as one of the best animated series ever, still wasn't a 100% perfect adaption. Those that want a perfect adaption are setting their expectations way too high.
 

BlueMoon

Lumen Cinereum
Sep 6, 2014
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#27
It is comparatively closer to the manga than the 90s anime was.

But I also think the changes they do make are more unforgivable.

For example neither the 90s anime nor Crystal has Mars, Jupiter, and Venus killing Jadeite, Nephrite, and Zoicite respectively like they do in the manga. But since the 90s anime is so much its own thing it doesn't really seem to be that noticeable and we just accept them as different things.

But then Crystal follows the manga a lot closer but takes away the girls bad a$$ moments? It reeks more of adaptation decay like they're purposely making the girls weak.
 

Clow

Luna Crescens
Jul 29, 2012
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#28
I far prefer the breakup arc in R than the shitennou x senshi pairings in Crystal.

I think one interesting aspect of the story that Crystal could have explored would be the shitennou x senshi pairings; however, as soon as the shitennou recover their memories they get killed and the story goes nowhere. TOEI trolling the fans.
 

Mitsukara

Luna Crescens
Apr 1, 2017
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#29
I've seen the entire 90s anime, read some of the manga (including Codename Sailor V which was amazing), up through the Black Moon arc, and seen only the first season/Dark Kingdom arc of Crystal.

I definitely prefer the 90s anime and am very attached to it's unique elements- basically, a lot of my favorite things only exist in that version. But I did enjoy/am still enjoying the Manga, and Crystal is good in it's own way too. I really do want to go back and finish the other arcs of Crystal eventually, after finishing the manga. Crystal is definitely not bad in my book.

That said, I think Crystal's more interesting qualities are mostly where it differs from the manga. The manga has fancier art, but Crystal tries to make sense of some of the more confusing action scenes (seriously, I still can't figure out what was supposed to be happening with the mannequin thing in Act 5 of the manga, with Motoki and Makoto getting maybe sorta brainwashed or what exactly and also Usagi's disguise looked way too much like Motoki which didn't help).

The Shitennou/Senshi thing, as an attempt to expand a plot point that was only evoked in passing by a chapter page opener, is honestly not too bad, and was interesting for a little while. I don't feel like it was as compelling as the Naru/Nephrite story or the Zoisite/Kunzite story, but I'm open to considering all kinds of wacky alternate ships (maybe it helps that I and my real-life husband practice conscientious polyamory, so I don't get hung up on one-true-pairing monogamy logic), and it had it's moments.

I feel like that arc would've worked better if they had made the season twice as long and spent more time developing how these characters interact. One of my biggest problems with the Manga and Crystal is that it never takes enough time to breathe and goof around to develop what these people are like, so they feel hollow in comparison. The 90s anime goofed around a little too much at times, but I'd rather wade through unimportant episodes than never slow down for character development.

I can kinda see, and even support, the decision not to have the Sailor Senshi doing the killing- that sort of makes them really creepy in the manga! Not much in the way of redemptions there, just good ol' gruesome, bloody war with few questions asked and fewer still answered. However, I do actually, seriously miss the fact that nobody ever gets their face melted in Crystal, as the manga had some amazing horror qualities to it that Crystal often swept under the rug.

It's also disappointing that they basically ended it the same way via a sudden 'rocks fall everybody dies' kinda moment, and that this prompts the Inner Senshi to get all weepy and sad at once in a scene that feels kind of... I don't know, it's a lot less badass than something like the whole D-Point march in episode 45, where they persevered through hellish circumstances. I'm also mystified by the fact that the Shitennou stones seem to break here- does Mamoru not have them to talk to in the Black Moon Arc of Crystal? If so, that's a travesty; that was one of the most exciting moments in the manga for me.

I also really like the song they made, "I'm Going Down". It's nice to finally have some kind of image song for the Shitennou, they never did this for most villain groups in the 90s. However, the background/incidental music in Crystal is mostly very dull and has nothing on Arisawa Takanori's beautiful soundtrack.

By the way, what's up with that casually-added little scene of Naru being good at the Sailor V arcade machine (which is canonically a Sailor Senshi training machine), in Crystal?? Were they screwing with our heads on purpose?

Lastly, I love the scene with Umino's bush hands. How did he sneak up on anybody like that??

So basically, I would say the first arc of Crystal certainly builds on the same structure of the Manga, but it veered off in a way that was sort of interesting, and could've perhaps been a lot more interesting if they did more with it. Alas. It had it's moments, though.
 
Mar 8, 2012
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#30
Tracey Moore is a fan of the manga and evidently does not think Crystal is all that faithful to it, so Sailor Moon has spoken! (Her comments start at around 6:20)

For those of you who can't watch/don't feel like watching the video, this is what she says:

I like the manga. I think the manga is brilliant. I would love to see something really true to the manga. Like, and I think you're going to see it. I think that the next time they hit "Sailor Moon," they're going to put more of that trueness in it. I really think so.
Earlier in the video, she also comments that she feels the characters in Crystal are a bit flatter/more static compared to the 90s anime.
 

DREWdesu

Luna Nova
Sep 24, 2008
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#31
^
I must say Tracey Moore emits a "Baby Spice" vibe with how she dresses and speaks in this video or maybe its me.
 

NJ_

Lumen Cinereum
Oct 31, 2009
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#32
Mitsukara said:
However, the background/incidental music in Crystal is mostly very dull and has nothing on Arisawa Takanori's beautiful soundtrack.
I personally don't mind Takanashi's score but I do agree that it isn't as good as Arisawa's was. One major problem I have with it though is that in addition to being mostly short in length, some of them were recycled from other shows he had worked on not too long ago.

Examples:

The main transformation theme in seasons 1 & 2 (2014) was originally from Smile Precure (2012).

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nxP3E38O3gw
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hipXANaLFos

Another tune was originally from Naruto Shippuden.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w2P0UF_TZ9s
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2UxxPc60mKc (0:00-0:26)

And this one I wasn't aware of until recently but two of season 3's tunes was originally from in The Severing Crime Edge (2013) and is the most obvious.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hBoy--H8FNg
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SbJvK1l3plI
(can't find the other Crystal tune but it basically had a portion of both but without a beat)

Lastly, I love the scene with Umino's bush hands. How did he sneak up on anybody like that??
I liked the online version much better.

 
May 31, 2009
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#33
NJ_ said:
And this one I wasn't aware of until recently but two of season 3's tunes was originally from in The Severing Crime Edge (2013) and is the most obvious.
This is the most egregious case. He didn't even bother changing it a little bit. ^_^'

Crystal is so lazy and cheap in literally every respect, it would be funny if it weren't so sad and pathetic. :confused:
 

rgveda99

Luna Crescens
Jul 5, 2009
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#34
Is this a common practice?

I know one tune from 90's Stars was used frequently in Digimon.
 

Mitsukara

Luna Crescens
Apr 1, 2017
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D-Point
#35
NJ_ said:
I liked the online version much better.
Wha? They changed the animation for the Hulu/online release??

rgveda99 said:
I know one tune from 90's Stars was used frequently in Digimon.
Whaaaaat? I had no idea! Do you know which one at all (by name, or where it appeared)?

Also, I forgot to mention this previously, but Moon Pride isn't a bad song either, and it was fun to see the Shitennou in an intro sequence (even if they're these less-cool Shitennou, and not that well drawn). The framing shot of Beryl cutting in on Usagi and Mamoru trying to hold hands is neat, too.

And hearing Kotono Mitsuishi play Usagi again is neat too. It's strange, though, she definitely sounds older. It gives me this strange feeling like Usagi actually is older than everybody else (which I guess kinda plays into the Silver Millenium past life thing)... it gives me this weird feeling like I'm watching just Usagi experience a weird vision or something, like when she was staring at those flowers on the way to Nehellenia's castle in Stars, like maybe if she kept staring for years then she'd see Sailor Moon Crystal happening in her mind, or something. I dunno, it's a strange effect, but I definitely like seeing her reprise the role in any case.
 

rgveda99

Luna Crescens
Jul 5, 2009
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#36
Mitsukara said:
NJ_ said:
I liked the online version much better.
Wha? They changed the animation for the Hulu/online release??

rgveda99 said:
I know one tune from 90's Stars was used frequently in Digimon.
Whaaaaat? I had no idea! Do you know which one at all (by name, or where it appeared)?
I could be wrong though. But it might be his work sounds too similar since it was made by the same composer.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Takanori_Arisawa


I believe this to be the one I hear in Digimon around 0:06-0:16.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6B_igRK6IVo
 

NJ_

Lumen Cinereum
Oct 31, 2009
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#37
Mitsukara said:
NJ_ said:
I liked the online version much better.
Wha? They changed the animation for the Hulu/online release??
http://crystalcomparisons.com/episodes/

It's the opposite, my screencap is from the online version while yours is from the Blu-ray/TV version.

rgveda99 said:
I know one tune from 90's Stars was used frequently in Digimon.
Whaaaaat? I had no idea! Do you know which one at all (by name, or where it appeared)?
He's referring to this one...

https://youtu.be/oqsVqSHisYo?t=2m35s
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x-t0BjGfmr0
 

Mitsukara

Luna Crescens
Apr 1, 2017
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#38
Wow! It's interesting that they changed it at all, and there's a ton of little changes. Some of them look better, but some of them actually look worse! Especially when they decided to redraw faces and hair- somebody was like "NO! Rei's eyes must be SUPER POINTY at ALL TIMES!! And heads that are round, have cool flyaway hairs, and shift appropriately at different angles are no longer allowed!", and sometimes they even reduce expressiveness (shrinking Usagi's open mouth and such). Other times it's a perfectly sensible thing to fix, like pink teeth. Other other times, the faces actually were more messed up the first time, and they made them a bit better. I wonder who got to decide what changed and what stayed, whether they got the original artists involved or not.

So Umino turned starkly silhouetted partway through the scene? That would probably have made it a lot easier to tell he was under the influence.

And that sure is the same melody from certain Animamates/Phage attack scenes being reused (with different instruments) in Digimon. Interesting! At least they re-recorded it instead of using the same track wholesale.
 

BlueMoon

Lumen Cinereum
Sep 6, 2014
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#39
At least its the same composer ripping himself off

Unlike the Dragon Ball Kai composer ripping everyone else off


or the sentai show Dairanger somehow not getting sued for ripping off the Imperial March.
 
May 1, 2015
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Pikari-gaoka
sparklyheartsdiana.tumblr.com
#40
SILVER said:
I'm happy that people aren't feeding into this, but I had the same thought. Its an established pattern in OP's post.
Why? All they're doing is giving a constructive criticism. Crystal did indeed alter/eliminate certain character scenes from the manga, such as:

  • Rei telling the crowd to "get lost" when she was being questioned (Act 3)
  • Makoto/Jupiter teasing Usagi saying she's a real moon bunny (Act 10)
  • Minako's CWOA being given to Usagi Sue (Act 12)

This was all I could come up with.