Season 4 movies update: Sailor Moon Eternal - Delayed to 2021 (Part 1 on January 8th & Part 2 on February 11th)

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foenyanko

Aurorae Lunares
Sep 21, 2010
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I think it's important to note that Toei doesn't owe us anything. Nor Takeuchi, beyond payment for the use of the property. They could have animated this like the Powerpuff Girls in Flash and that would have been within their rights.

If you hate the way it looks, feel free to be bitter and wish for more. But that doesn't mean everyone's obligated to feel the same.
 
Likes: Touslesetages

sapphire91

Solaris Luna
Jul 6, 2018
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To be honest while not looking mind-blowing, it still looks nice and nothing strikes as downright awful. As we should have learned by now - they will never go all the way with it. We are yet to see it in motion, yet to see close ups, yet to see handling of key scenes, atmosphere, writing etc. People are free to share their opinion. The movie might still e enjoyable even though the artstyle is not up to some people standards. I hate season 3 designs, but still enjoyed the improved writing, direction and the season was pretty enjoyable. Nobody is forcing anyone to watch the films, so if you do not like it - don't watch it. At the begining I found the designs bad and the first key visual like a parody, but stuff ended up looking a lot better.. So maybe these still frames will be way different in motion.

Let's focus on the positives here - true the profiles are not particularly good, but the composition of the shots is great. The characters vary in facial expretion, you can totally see each ones emotions just from the shot. Usagi and Chibi Usa are dying out of excitment, Minako is her usual curious self, Masko is downplaying her inner "sugoi", Mamoru is like "What am I doing here", Rei is completely drawn somewhere else, following her intuition, while Ai is like "What are they so excited about. It is just a Circus and they have been around since centuries ago. They emote and this is still a big step up for the reboot.
 
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yaya_ikuto

Luna Crescens
Jan 16, 2018
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To be honest while not looking mind-blowing, it still looks nice and nothing strikes as downright awful. As we should have learned by now - they will never go all the way with it. We are yet to see it in motion, yet to see close ups, yet to see handling of key scenes, atmosphere, writing etc. People are free to share their opinion. The movie might still e enjoyable even though the artstyle is not up to some people standards. I hate season 3 designs, but still enjoyed the improved writing, direction and the season was pretty enjoyable. Nobody is forcing anyone to watch the films, so if you do not like it - don't watch it. At the begining I found the designs bad and the first key visual like a parody, but stuff ended up looking a lot better.. So maybe these still frames will be way different in motion.
yeah i accept maybe for designs i wanted something else like more details or more manga like that the poster have it, but i prefer having better story telling direction and the manga story with all its power
is true thats why i like season 3 they give it more for the story and was good
 

GuerreroLuna

Luna Crescens
Jun 1, 2014
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The thing that actually annoys me is that nobody actually said this was a masterpiece that was going to be placed in the hall of fame of anime.
I've seen people being cautious, saying it looks "good" and that they can't wait for the release. I mean it's no friggin' Sailor Mars from SMC Season 1's opening.
Perhaps in January I'll say the movie is hideous? Ok, but I'll do it based on the product in movement not based on a still image. Just take a look at this :


I mean, this looks awful but we know the animation in SuperS was superb. It is silly to judge a whole episode and a whole season because of this frame.
 
Nov 8, 2018
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The thing that actually annoys me is that nobody actually said this was a masterpiece that was going to be placed in the hall of fame of anime.
I've seen people being cautious, saying it looks "good" and that they can't wait for the release. I mean it's no friggin' Sailor Mars from SMC Season 1's opening.
Perhaps in January I'll say the movie is hideous? Ok, but I'll do it based on the product in movement not based on a still image. Just take a look at this :


I mean, this looks awful but we know the animation in SuperS was superb. It is silly to judge a whole episode and a whole season because of this frame.
This frame probably has not been used to promote the movie back in the days. Usually a company shows the best sides of the product that they want to sell. Toei on the other hand...
 

Touslesetages

Luna Crescens
Apr 5, 2020
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To be honest while not looking mind-blowing, it still looks nice and nothing strikes as downright awful. As we should have learned by now - they will never go all the way with it. We are yet to see it in motion, yet to see close ups, yet to see handling of key scenes, atmosphere, writing etc. People are free to share their opinion. The movie might still e enjoyable even though the artstyle is not up to some people standards. I hate season 3 designs, but still enjoyed the improved writing, direction and the season was pretty enjoyable. Nobody is forcing anyone to watch the films, so if you do not like it - don't watch it. At the begining I found the designs bad and the first key visual like a parody, but stuff ended up looking a lot better.. So maybe these still frames will be way different in motion.

Let's focus on the positives here - true the profiles are not particularly good, but the composition of the shots is great. The characters vary in facial expretion, you can totally see each ones emotions just from the shot. Usagi and Chibi Usa are dying out of excitment, Minako is her usual curious self, Masko is downplaying her inner "sugoi", Mamoru is like "What am I doing here", Rei is completely drawn somewhere else, following her intuition, while Ai is like "What are they so excited about. It is just a Circus and they have been around since centuries ago. They emote and this is still a big step up for the reboot.

Exactly!! It’s looks nice. I feel like I’m going crazy saying that but it looks nice, it does. I wanted WIT or MAPPA but it’s Toei and it’s their word vendetta against sailor moon. Lol But hon style as long as there aren’t any Obvious sailor Murs moments throughout this entire Movie, then I’m actually quite satisfied. Honestly all I wanted from this reboot (from the beginning) is a pretty and faithful adaptation. I didn’t expect something groundbreaking, but I defiantly wish it went without all of the inexcusable animation issues.

Could you imagine if crystal didn’t have any of the wonkiness from the beginning? I wonder what fans would think?
 
Nov 8, 2018
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Crystal minus wonkiness, plus better screenplay and more creative storyboards could have resulted in a great second anime adaptation. Fans got over stuff like the 3D henshin, many even started appreciating them.

EDIT: the senshi x shitennou shipping was badly executed, but it is not the reason why s1 wasn‘t that great. it‘s just one of many reasons. if animation/screenplay/storyboard had been better in general, we‘d also forgive this fauxpas.

The team behind Crystal was very ambitious, but Toei decided to let the project starve.
 
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Touslesetages

Luna Crescens
Apr 5, 2020
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Crystal minus wonkiness, plus better screenplay and more creative storyboards could have resulted in a great second anime adaptation. Fans got over stuff like the 3D henshin, many even started appreciating them.

The team behind Crystal was very ambitious, but Toei decided to let the project starve.
I think the team with Kon and the new writer from the beginning could’ve made it what it should have been. I feel like before all of this Toei was far more open to letting the team experiment more.
 
May 31, 2009
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Tankei Kingdom, Kinmoku
This is an extremely gross take, not gonna lie. People should be allowed to like things, and people should be allowed to dislike things. But people who dislike things based off of misinformation should be at least educated on the subject. Also, if you were talking about me, you could have at least had the decency to quote me if you're gonna say I have stockholm syndrome for Toei or whatever.

I'm personally just really sick of people on this forum and twitter going around and talking trash and/or harassing random animators and directors for things they have almost no control over.
I was not talking about you. I don't understand why you took this personally. My post wasn't even right after yours. I'm obviously not talking about every fan. There are people who genuinely like it, and that's fine of course, but there are fans who don't, but feel obligated to say they do. You can tell when someone is relactuntly trying to give ho-hum praise. Perhaps it's the pressure from other fans or fear of being chastized for their true opinions and be called bad/fake fan. Also, I never said it was OK to harass production crew on Twitter. Where did that come from?
 

Seen2

Lumen Cinererum
Nov 16, 2016
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I was not talking about you. I don't understand why you took this personally. My post wasn't even right after yours. I'm obviously not talking about every fan.
There's only one post between mine, reminding others that actual humans are working on this movie, and yours, saying that some fans seem to have lowered their standards, are lying to themselves, and/or are in an abuse relationship with Toei. It's not a leap to assume you're talking about someone who was defending the production crew just a bit earlier.

Even if you weren't talking about me, that post was really messed up and insulting to people who are optimistic or like what they've seen.

There are people who genuinely like it, and that's fine of course, but there are fans who don't, but feel obligated to say they do. You can tell when someone is relactuntly trying to give ho-hum praise. Perhaps it's the pressure from other fans or fear of being chastized for their true opinions and be called bad/fake fan.
While I disagree with the idea that you can tell for certain if someone genuinely likes something or if they're just trying to fit in, nobody would have been upset with you if you posted something like this in the first place.

Also, I never said it was OK to harass production crew on Twitter. Where did that come from?
I was explaining my position from the assumption that you were talking about me. I never said you said it was okay to harass people.

All I was saying was that there are people who constantly do it and that's why I'm trying to be vocal about how insanely hard it is to be an animator, especially on a Toei project.

Even in this forum you still get the occasional posts from different people saying that the animators are the problem, that animation director for this movie can't draw the designs right, or that the budget is an issue. Nobody can paint the Mona Lisa in five minutes, even if you give them a billion dollars beforehand. Drawings, corrections, and good animation in general takes time, which is something the higher ups at Toei (and sponsor companies) don't often afford their staff. This is why S1/2 looked so terrible 99% of the time. People need to understand this stuff before posting fanmade redrawings of individual frames that probably took at least over an hour to make.
 
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Jul 7, 2014
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I think TOEI had been experimenting in how exactly they should revive properties. They started experimenting with KAI a remaster with new voice track and it went fine in Japan and then great in other countries. (Except Mexico due to voice changes)

Then they tried to refresh properties like Sailor Moon and Digimon, giving them new designs and soundtrack but neither worked. Not that they were failures but they just didn’t sell as expected.

But when Dragon Ball movies and Super retained voice actors, designs and other elements, and it turned out to be a success, they realized that was the way to go, appealing to nostalgia.

That’s probably why the new Digimon series kept the old designs and voice actors and why it has a lot of episodes programmed.

And it’s probably why we have a change in designer in Sailor Moon and also a new script writer. However I think is a case where it’s to little too late because this series is almost over! Also why turn it into films?!

The last thing I wonder about and find really interesting is why Naomi just became a consultant and not from the beginning?

Well let’s just wait and see more of Eternal and hopefully it turns out to be a great product!
 
Toei made Crystal Season 1 & 2 with a sophisticated style. It was as close to the manga as you could get animation wise. Most people didn't want that. They want "slapstick" Sailor Moon, 90's Sailor Moon, not a "mature" looking version like Season 2.

Dream became a film either for budgetary reasons or because the way the manga is done doesn't work well as a series and would work better as a film. Honestly, none of the villains last long and things in the manga are not built upon for impressionable foes like in the series. The Amazon Trio die really early and so forth...pretty much forgettable. Imagine if we never knew them like we did in the 90s anime and they were monsters of the day?

Pandering aside, Toei should have left the art style as is and applied the budget to new transformations and touch up scenes.

Season 1 & 2 were unique to the series. Aside from the animation blunders, which they put more money into to correct on the Blu-ray, the only other issue was the fast paced, character destroying story and that's not their fault, that's the way the manga is structured and probably what Naoko wanted to see. Sailor Moon how she intended it to be. Let's be honest, why would they include the Shitenou and Senshi relationship out of the blue without asking Naoko if she wanted to see that? Something so random as that?

Why would they produce an artstyle without seeing if she liked it or likes the overall designs for it?

Kunzite looks cool in Season 1, can you imagine how goofy he'd look in Season 3's artstyle with flashlight eyes and rubber hair?

If Toei really didn't care about Sailor Moon, they would have trashed it and gave up on it a long time ago. Yet, they are still putting money into it, though probably not as much for a series.

Eternal will be fine...but it will be great to some and not so much to others. Some people on social media have doomed the film without even seeing the film, so whatever that's all about, they have a right to not like it but no one can know how it will turn out unless they actually see it for themselves.

I think the Naomi thing is cool in a way since she is popular and will attract more people to see it who like her work. Since the story of Sailor Moon is technically not anything new they have to apply popular ("relevant") people to it who will bring their fans over to it.

Sailor Moon will forever be an anime icon though when it comes to magical girls. That's just something that will never go away with the series. The anime story itself is a tad bit dated tho. Aside form the musicals, only PGSM did something unique and it worked for the story, adding new characters, conflicts, and weapons and more, pity they didn't have a bigger budget cause the show was pretty dynamic and would have been an interesting take if it was an anime...(of course some people would have hated it that way too.)

DBZ and Digimon can get away with this I guess because even though they have the same cast and stuff, they go on different adventures, bring in new characters, and face new challenges. Pretty Cure does the same thing. Sailor Moon anime doesn't tho....

If you've read the manga, you've seen most of the movie's first screenplay draft. What they develop it into after that is up in the air but it's the same thing we've seen already more or less waiting to move around
 

Rika-Chicchi

Staff member
Site Admin
May 7, 2009
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I think Naoko is once again not as involved as it seems. They changed stuff a bit due to the movie format, needed her approval for the changes and give her credit.
Maybe her relationship w/ them is now somewhat like QEII's w/ her PM - largely ceremonial/nominal while continuously receiving the income to sustain her & her family's daily expenses. :lol:
 

sapphire91

Solaris Luna
Jul 6, 2018
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Some people are really really ovsessed with them continuing the story after Stars that they will bash whatever they release from the reboot. Other people cannot take off the nostalgia glasses and just want the 99s anime not just aesthetic, but they want the whole cheesy slap stick feel. By now they also should be aware this won't hapoen and move on till a completely new adaptation shows up. There are people that are very manga purists that are unhappy with the changes and the 90s style. I personally never found the 90s style very different from the manga and with more details added it could look incredibe. Eternal for me doesn't look the 90s show and in this regard are agree people are deluded. But yeah, mamga purists are not happy as well. Then there are people that just want more of Sailor Moon and Crystal fans that despite all the problems, design changes etc. still enjoy the adaptation and despite being disappointed at times, see some aspects good enough to keep going. All of these people are well aware of the problems, but despite enjoy it. Most of us enjoyed the 90s show and the manga despite the very inconsistent animation/manga drawings and plot that us not always making sense, especially in the 90s.
Once we see the movies and they are indeed bad in everything then we can bash them, but as of now we know nothing about the final product. What would really make a bad impression and should be criticized is if these two movies end up with a low budget but their homemade release is as expensive as let's say Violet Evergarden film, which is 3 hours long, it's animation studio went through hell, still finished it almost on time despite the tragedy that happened and still looks impeccably impressive.
 
Sep 11, 2020
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I find it peculiar how the fandom has been reacting lately. It's not that Sailor Moon fans have simply lowered their standards and expectations (which they have), but from what I've observed here and elsewhere online, fans are desperately trying to convince themselves, and others, that what we are getting is good when it's really not and are trying really hard to like it and say something positive when you can tell they're not feeling it and aren't satisfied. It's like they are in an abusive relationship with Toei.
Sailor Moon has never been a super high budget project. The 90s anime was horribly inconsistent, had some awful art directors (Masahiro Ando and Taichi Nakamura were literally my Satan), and did a lot of cheap things to avoid actually animating stuff. PGSM had extremely low budget costumes and effects. Even Naoko's manga had some errors that made me wonder what the editors were doing.

Sailor Moon Crystal was significantly worse than previous Sailor Moon projects, but acting like fans are suddenly dropping their standards from those of an avant garde elitist to those of someone who enjoys crayon scribbles is a massive reach. Sailor Moon fans have had to forgive and look past shoddy stuff for decades; this isn't new.

Besides, I don't think anybody trusts that a large company actually cares about them. No company gives a [BLEEP] about people. Toei is just another company that wants money, and we are all aware of this; we just like getting Sailor Moon content.

Also, making comparisons like this to abusive relationships is just very... out of touch.

Anyways, I honestly think they look fine, and the hate for season 3 is kind of crazy to me. I thought the Tellu and Saturn debut episodes looked absolutely lovely and significantly better than the 90s anime episodes done by Ando and Nakamura. Season 1 and 2 looked awful, though, with some exceptions.
 

Rika-Chicchi

Staff member
Site Admin
May 7, 2009
37,857
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I think the Hotaru parts in S3 are largely a (if not the) jewel of Crystal. :cool:

As for the franchise as a whole, it seems to be a historical accident in the manga/anime industry - even to Takeuchi herself. lol
 

Clow

Stella
Jul 29, 2012
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I am not exactly a fan of “Sailor Moon,” but I loved the 90’s anime greatly as a kid, and I was one of those who expressed frustration with Crystal in 2014.

But the problem was that TOEI was giving us 2 unfinished episodes each month.

I own SMC seasons 1–3 on DVD and I believe, today, that SMC seasons 1–2, at least, are fantastic. I was able to obtain the DVDs, to watch the finished product, and my opinion has changed. I love SMC seasons 1–2. To have a great experience watching seasons 1–2, you must watch at least 2 episodes per day. And SMC season 2, specifically, is actually superior to and much better than “Sailor Moon R,“ in my opinion.