Seriously

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#62
OMFG That is wicked cute. I think everyone SHOULD get one.

Yeah I know the article is cheesy itself, so sue me. I am trying to set a good example for the kids that come to my site and for the community. It's inherent in my blood. I want everyone to be friends. Or at least, to not [BLEEP] all over other people to make themselves feel better.
 
Feb 9, 2004
862
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Atlanta
www.still-frames.net
#63
Of all the posters, I agree most with dooky. It's all in the right spirit--so who cares if a lot of it (most of it) sucks? You don't HAVE to read it if you don't care for that sort of thing.

People write poetry, songs, paint, whatever--those may not ever be seen or heard by anyone other than the author but that doesn't mean the time was wasted or that the author didn't gain anything from doing it.
 

Kasumi

Lapis Lunaris
Dec 10, 2003
128
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kasumicc.livejournal.com
#64
I'm pretty sure that most SM fans have made their own Otaku Senshi at least once ^^ The problems start when those Otaku Senshi are inserted in Fanfictions...it all depends of the skills of the writer :)


As for the term "Mary Sue"...I suppose every fandom has started giving it their own meaning :D For example...
In the FMA fandom, Mary Sues are the self-insertion characters (or new characters) that commonly end paired up with Edward xDDDD (and according to that definition, there are even official Mary Sues :P )

Probably for most SM fans "Mary Sue" is synonym of Otaku Senshi :P

I think the best thing in this case is to keep up the common meaning: Mary Sue = self-insertion characters. And let's not associate Otaku Senshi with Mary Sue...fanfics should be evaluated according to their quality and not for their degree of "Mary Sue-ness" :D
 

Kerochan no Miko

Knight Radiant
Staff member
Site Admin
Feb 29, 2004
6,242
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#65
From what I've seen, the common definition of "Mary Sue" seems to be "self insertion character that somehow causes the canon characters to act out of character."

It may have started out one way, but definitions can change over time.

And also, I personally think that if crap is crap it deserves to be called such, because people won't improve their writing if everyone is so busy blowing sunshine at them that they think their fiction is amazingly wonderful and flawless.
 
#66
Well, that's also not what I am saying either. What I suggest in that article is that existing member in the community encourage new authors and new character creators to improve their stories and characters without bashing their enthusiasm or writing them off as a waste of time. I certainly don't think you should tell someone their work is strong if it sucks. I'm an artist; good critique is a huge part of my life.

The biggest problem with the Mary Sue thing, I feel, is that no matter the personal definition, people tend to use it in place of more constructive thoughts. For example, "Your senshi is a Mary Sue and it sucks." vs "Your character seems to have a lot of elements of your personality and history. While it is easy to write what you know, a lot can be said for coming up with new ideas for your characters. Perhaps you could do some reserch into personality and character development. Here are some helpful links!"
 

Kasumi

Lapis Lunaris
Dec 10, 2003
128
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kasumicc.livejournal.com
#67
xDDDD I discovered the term Mary Sue not some long ago...I didn't know it was so popular :)

"Your Senshi is a Mary Sue"...I can't help it, I find it funny :D
But you're right, commentaries like that are really vague >.< It makes you wonder..."What did he/she mean?" :D
 

Jadeite2

Site Admin
Dec 31, 2003
2,760
15
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#68
To me, and I'm looking at this from the perspective of fanfics because that's about as far as my experience goes with otaku senshi and such, as long as the story is good I don't give a crap if the character is based on the author or not. If it's well written, interesting, engaging, and believable, then it really doesn't matter.

If the story is not those things and it sucks, then the character being based on the author still doesn't matter; just don't read it.
 

rami

Lapis Lunaris
Jun 18, 2005
6
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Australia
#69
Maybe part of the 'problem' with author created characters is that often the 'Mary Sues' take over the story and are really only there for the author's own self gratification in writing them there. :roll: It's arguable, but I think it can be assumed most people read fanfiction to read about the characters from the anime/book/movie in situations outside of the normal canon.

A lot original characters are created by authors who just want to insert their own original creation amongst all their favourite Sailor Moon characters. The problem is that the story then just becomes seeing how the original character interacts with all the canon characters and is only really entertaining for the author, who actually might care about the OC.

Now this isn't always true and it's probably one of the most difficult things to successfully write an original main character into a fanficiton because it means that the author has to create some sort of connection between the character and readers, but when it is done successfully, it's generally because the author is a good writer.

Which is my final point, that maybe the stereotype of 'Mary Sue' characters being crap is that because they are generally (not always) written into crap stories by crap authors.
 

Kerochan no Miko

Knight Radiant
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Feb 29, 2004
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#74
I can only think of maybe one or two crossover stories that I've read where the crossover wasn't completely implausible. I tend to avoid them whenever possible, because they generally seem to be an excuse for the author to combine two fandoms they like without regard for hows or whys.
 

Jadeite2

Site Admin
Dec 31, 2003
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#77
The_Otaku_Witch said:
I find most canon-only stories dull, I like crossovers a lot more. The only canon-only story I remember was called the Chibi Scouts of something like that and it was based on the dub, where all the senshi were turned into 4 year olds.
Doug Helm and Will Wolfsohl's thing, yeah. I have bad mojo about it because Helm was a dick to me, and that was like 9 years ago.
 

Kasumi

Lapis Lunaris
Dec 10, 2003
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#78
Just to know...

I've found some really good fics featuring this situation: an alternative universe with no Sailor Senshi, but a normal life. This type of fics often focuses on the development of the characters more than the action...

Does that count as crossover, or not? O_O
 
#79
Kasumi said:
Just to know...

I've found some really good fics featuring this situation: an alternative universe with no Sailor Senshi, but a normal life. This type of fics often focuses on the development of the characters more than the action...

Does that count as crossover, or not? O_O
No I don't think that's a crossover, it's just AU.
 
#80
Megaman said:
The_Otaku_Witch said:
I find most canon-only stories dull, I like crossovers a lot more. The only canon-only story I remember was called the Chibi Scouts of something like that and it was based on the dub, where all the senshi were turned into 4 year olds.
Doug Helm and Will Wolfsohl's thing, yeah. I have bad mojo about it because Helm was a dick to me, and that was like 9 years ago.
That's a shame. But I suppose you don't nessarily need to be a nice person to write entertaining fiction I suppose. Mind you when I re-read it after a several year gap I do remember my attitude changing toward it. Mainly because Raye was so horrible in it.

Kerochan no Miko said:
I can only think of maybe one or two crossover stories that I've read where the crossover wasn't completely implausible. I tend to avoid them whenever possible, because they generally seem to be an excuse for the author to combine two fandoms they like without regard for hows or whys.
Well... if I'm honest that's the exact reason why I like crossovers, though I admit sometimes when the hows and whys are too out there I can't read the fiction. Also I hate crossovers where canon realationships are split up to ship to characters from diffrent fandoms together for not reason even more than when the same is done with a self-insert or other canon characters. I came across an Usagi/Sirius Black one once O_o (this was pre OotP) and I find Usagi/Draco ones annoying too.