Why I HATE Stars Ending SO MUCH

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MariaTenebre

Systema Solare
Jul 22, 2009
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#61
But the way it was presented was not relieved enough. She didn't make any sacrifice.

Nehellenia's ppl were nobody and they were only introduced in that scene. The senshi were all around there and loved by the audience.

After killing them with such cruelty, the audience all wanted to see Galaxia suffer a bad defeat, or atone for her crime with some heavy price. Even Nehelllenia was defeated and turned into old woman in the end of SS.

I'm not saying was Galaxia innocent or not, but the way the whole thing was presented was awful. We don't care about who defeated Chaos, we need Chaos' influence to be shown in the process to let ppl blame him not Galaxia if you don't plan to make Galaxia the one to take responsibility.
She did though. She sacrificed herself to seal Chaos away but when Chaos proved too powerful in the end Sailor Moon exorcised Sailor Chaos from her. Also why does that matter. Nehellenia's people were her own servants that she willingly devoured. Sailor Galaxia was at best driven insane and manipulated by Sailor Chaos. Once more she does bring back all of the Inners, Outers and Tuxedo Mask in the end and promises to return all of the Star Seeds of the other Sailor Senshi she killed so I imagine she will restore the Animamates to their true Good Senshi forms. I see no logical reason why Sailor Galaxia should suffer a bad defeat or a heavy price. In fact if anything again this was more warranted for Nehellenia. Why does it not matter that all of the people she consumed were "nobodies" they were all members of her kingdom. In fact I would argue that what Nehellenia did was far worse then what Sailor Galaxia did and her Kingdom was only brought back due to Sailor Moon, Tuxedo Mask, Sailor Chibi Moon along with the Inners and Outers as opposed to anything she did or could do. Sailor Galaxia however attoned by herself and in her own power. I by no means think or wanted to see Sailor Galaxia suffer a bad defeat or "atone with a heavy price" and I think that the idea of anyone wanting that is silly and makes no logical sense.

Also Chaos's influence was shown. Chaos was mentioned to have been sealed away and it was shown that the reason for Sailor Galaxia's corruption was due to Chaos's influence and besides the whole thing of Sailor Galaxia being the Legendary Soldier and Chaos being sealed inside her was supposed to be a twist ending.
 
Apr 1, 2020
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#62
She did though. She sacrificed herself to seal Chaos away but when Chaos proved too powerful in the end Sailor Moon exorcised Sailor Chaos from her. Also why does that matter. Nehellenia's people were her own servants that she willingly devoured. Sailor Galaxia was at best driven insane and manipulated by Sailor Chaos. Once more she does bring back all of the Inners, Outers and Tuxedo Mask in the end and promises to return all of the Star Seeds of the other Sailor Senshi she killed so I imagine she will restore the Animamates to their true Good Senshi forms. I see no logical reason why Sailor Galaxia should suffer a bad defeat or a heavy price. In fact if anything again this was more warranted for Nehellenia. Why does it not matter that all of the people she consumed were "nobodies" they were all members of her kingdom.
It has nothing to do with her modern day's killing.

Nehellenia's ppl were nobody to the audience, they have little personality and popularity, like only very little screentime. It's very hard for ppl to feel really bad for them that much. When they were restored, then everything is fine.


The senshi were different, they were all around regular cast, loved by so many ppl. The Inner's death in the first season shocked so many ppl because we love them.

If someone kills them, of course their supporters would want the foe to pay heavily, just like the DD girls and Eudial. Till today I still feel that way.



Again I think it is ridiculous how people think that Sailor Galaxia deserves a "beat down" when it wasn't her fault.
Because it was shown that way.

In fact I would argue that what Nehellenia did was far worse then what Sailor Galaxia did and her Kingdom was only brought back due to Sailor Moon, Tuxedo Mask, Sailor Chibi Moon along with the Inners and Outers as opposed to anything she did or could do. Sailor Galaxia however attoned by herself and in her own power. I by no means think or wanted to see Sailor Galaxia suffer a bad defeat or "atone with a heavy price" and I think that the idea of anyone wanting that is silly and makes no logical sense.

Also Chaos's influence was shown. Chaos was mentioned to have been sealed away and it was shown that the reason for Sailor Galaxia's corruption was due to Chaos's influence and besides the whole thing of Sailor Galaxia being the Legendary Soldier and Chaos being sealed inside her was supposed to be a twist ending.
Chaos was only mentioned, without much clear influence shown until the last moment. He wasn't a real "character" in ppl's eyes, so it's impossible to switch the anger to him.

If you want to let the audience blame him, you need to make it clear like showing Galaxia being possessed in the beginning, or showing Galaxia's true personality much much earlier, to show her struggle, that's how you handle a plot.

I've mentioned Bucky the Winter Soldier before. He was shown to be Steve's good pal, suffered such brainwash, Hydra was also seen as a main threat. Yet still many ppl feel angry when the scene of him killing Tony's parents were shown, and side with Tony.

Imagine if we had none of this setup, having him killing important characters, then reveal that he was good in the last moment, how much ppl would even feel bad for him?

It's very important to understand that you can't just write something good or bad, you need to let the audience feel it. Somtimes killing a thousand ppl doesn't shock as much as killing one.

Again I'm not arguing about is she evil or is Nehellenia much worse, but about how it was presented.
 
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sailormoongalaxy

Lumen Cinererum
Apr 16, 2013
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#63
Chaos was only mentioned, without much clear influence shown until the last moment. He wasn't a real "character" in ppl's eyes, so it's impossible to switch the anger to him.

If you want to let the audience blame him, you need to make it clear like showing Galaxia being possessed in the beginning, or showing Galaxia's true personality much much earlier, to show her struggle, that's how you handle a plot.

I've mentioned Bucky the Winter Soldier before. He was shown to be Steve's good pal, suffered such brainwash, Hydra was also seen as a main threat. Yet still many ppl feel angry when the scene of him killing Tony's parents were shown, and side with Tony.

Imagine if we had none of this setup, having him killing important characters, then reveal that he was good in the last moment, how much ppl would even feel bad for him?

It's very important to understand that you can't just write something good or bad, you need to let the audience feel it. Somtimes killing a thousand ppl doesn't shock as much as killing one.

Again I'm not arguing about is she evil or is Nehellenia much worse, but about how it was presented.
On the contrary, the twist is well brought up. I prefer that we have a twist like this, what to say from the start, that she is bad because she is under the yoke of Chaos.

Because when the Starlights, Moon, learn that she is the legendary warrior and at the same time that it is she who sealed Chaos, well we are the same as them, shocked!
With me, I loved this twist, find out at the end, the truth.
 
Apr 1, 2020
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#64
On the contrary, the twist is well brought up. I prefer that we have a twist like this, what to say from the start, that she is bad because she is under the yoke of Chaos.

Because when the Starlights, Moon, learn that she is the legendary warrior and at the same time that it is she who sealed Chaos, well we are the same as them, shocked!
With me, I loved this twist, find out at the end, the truth.
If you prefer such twist, then you shouldn't let her kill off the senshi, or let her minions do the job.

Otherwise the problem is here.
 

yaya_ikuto

Lumen Cinererum
Jan 16, 2018
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#65
mh i dont know why galaxia purification is a hand holding or a shake of hands is better if they use the silver crystal, or maybe the star seed from the senshi give power to sailor moon XD but well to make it more iconic i think some silver crystal power, or the star seed from galaxia give usagi power up than a sword
 

sailormoongalaxy

Lumen Cinererum
Apr 16, 2013
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#66
mh i dont know why galaxia purification is a hand holding or a shake of hands is better if they use the silver crystal, or maybe the star seed from the senshi give power to sailor moon XD but well to make it more iconic i think some silver crystal power, or the star seed from galaxia give usagi power up than a sword
The moment the sword is broken, Galaxia's star seed is dead. It is simply the power of the silver crystal and the locked-in Galaxia's will that makes this miracle exist.
 
Jun 17, 2019
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#67
We did actually see some conflicts with her in the end especially when Sailor Tin Nyanko sees her unclothed. However I personally like Sailor Galaxia's 90s anime story much more then the manga story where she was just an emo rage child. I liked the idea of her being a strong and valiant soldier whos sacrificed herself to seal Chaos inside her to end the Sailor Wars. Plus I like the inclusion of the Sailor Wars. I honestly don't think the Sailor Wars of the past existed in the manga and as such I much like Sailor Galaxia's story in the 90s anime as opposed to what we got in the manga.
If all you got out of Manga!Galaxia was “emo rage child” then you seriously missed the point. I suggest reading the Stars arc again cause she’s so much more than that, or just read my in-depth analysis I did of her in this thread:

Do you think villains got redeemed too much sometimes?

Also the manga did have something of a Sailor Wars, even though it wasn’t titled as such. Galaxia, a Senshi, was going around the Milkyway fighting and murdering every Senshi she came across, or recruiting Senshi to her cause and having them fight other Senshi for her. (See Lethe and Mnemosyne)

Also again Sailor Galaxia wasn't responsible for her actions. It was Chaos warping her so she dosen't deserve a "hard beatdown." That is just silly. Likewise Chaos was very much a character in the 90s anime. Sailor Galaxia sealed Chaos away inside of her and when Sailor Galaxia's Golden Bracelets broke that was Chaos that took her over and from that point on until Chaos was exorcised from Sailor Galaxia that was Chaos battling Sailor Moon. That is why that form was even called Chaos Galaxia.

Again I think it is ridiculous how people think that Sailor Galaxia deserves a "beat down" when it wasn't her fault.
No one’s trying to argue that anime Galaxia is responsible for her actions and deserves “a beat-down.” Just the possession explanation itself wasn’t thought out and felt like such a cop out. All previous villains up to that point who got redeemed were evil, but that’s precisely what made their redemption so meaningful in the first place, because they learned from it.

Meanwhile Galaxia’s incredibly heinous actions were just waved away as “PSYCHE! It wasn’t really her all along, she’s actually a good guy guys, trust me!” Even though we knew nothing about her beforehand and hadn’t heard of her good deeds until like the last few episodes, it feels jarring because it is.

(And yes, it was an obvious last minute asspull cause they were clearly going to introduce Sailor Cosmos someway in the anime what with that silhouette of hers Usagi saw, but backed out at the last minute and cooked up some lame excuse on how Chibi-Chibi was actually Galaxia’s Star Seed who was “the Legendary Senshi all along” even though it doesn’t make a lick of sense.

I'll take Galaxia being an ancient Sailor Senshi who once saved the world in the 90's anime over her being someone who was jealous of how awesome and strong Usagi is in the manga. The latter felt like a watered down version of anime!Nehelenia.
At least Manga Galaxia actually had a personality and we know stuff about her unlike 90’a anime Galaxia who’s just a glorified plot device.

And Anime Galaxia admires Usagi all the same and admits she surpassed her, so what’s even the difference? (It’s actually even more ridiculous in the 90’s anime since at least in the Manga Galaxia started from nothing whereas in the 90’s she has the self-proclaimed title as “Strongest and most Pure-Hearted Senshi in the Galaxy”)

On the contrary, the twist is well brought up. I prefer that we have a twist like this, what to say from the start, that she is bad because she is under the yoke of Chaos.

Because when the Starlights, Moon, learn that she is the legendary warrior and at the same time that it is she who sealed Chaos, well we are the same as them, shocked!
With me, I loved this twist, find out at the end, the truth.
A twist just for the sake of there being a twist and for shock value doesn’t suddenly make it good writing. The twist first has to have proper set-up beforehand and actually make sense, otherwise it just comes off as contrived.
 
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Nov 16, 2016
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#68
If all you got out of Manga!Galaxia was “emo rage child” then you seriously missed the point. I suggest reading the Stars arc again cause she’s so much more than that, or just read my in-depth analysis I did of her in this thread:

Do you think villains got redeemed too much sometimes?
You think Galaxia is some girlboss who's fighting the Star Seed system by committing galactic genocide? I think her backstory is interesting too, but the analysis as a whole is a reach imo.


No one’s trying to argue that anime Galaxia is responsible for her actions and deserves “a beat-down.” Just the possession explanation itself wasn’t thought out and felt like such a cop out. All previous villains up to that point who got redeemed were evil, but that’s precisely what made their redemption so meaningful in the first place, because they learned from it.
She didn't learn anything besides realizing there's always a future and seeing just how optimistic Usagi is. Is that bad? No. But it's not like she ever showed a bit of regret for her actions (not that there was any room for it in the few panels it happened in).

Meanwhile Galaxia’s incredibly heinous actions were just waved away as “PSYCHE! It wasn’t really her all along, she’s actually a good guy guys, trust me!” Even though we knew nothing about her beforehand and hadn’t heard of her good deeds until like the last few episodes, it feels jarring because it is.

(And yes, it was an obvious last minute asspull cause they were clearly going to introduce Sailor Cosmos someway in the anime what with that silhouette of hers Usagi saw, but backed out at the last minute and cooked up some lame excuse on how Chibi-Chibi was actually Galaxia’s Star Seed who was “the Legendary Senshi all along” even though it doesn’t make a lick of sense.
They made it pretty clear she had something else going on in several scenes even before episode 194 spelled it out.

Also, how is it an asspull to not have Chibi Chibi be Sailor Cosmos? She shares the same design in her shillouette, but nothing else in the 90's anime remotely implied she was Usagi from the distant future.

ALSO also, you think it's an asspull that she was possessed, something that was set up earlier, but you're totally fine with the manga having Chaos, and, retroactively, and all the other final bosses of the series not actually being evil and just lonely?

At least Manga Galaxia actually had a personality and we know stuff about her unlike 90’a anime Galaxia who’s just a glorified plot device.
She's exactly the same except in the manga she has a different backstory and is obsessed with Usagi. She still destroys stuff, kills people, laughs about it, and acts serious and somber from time to time. Her role in the story is different, but her behavior really isn't.

And Anime Galaxia admires Usagi all the same and admits she surpassed her, so what’s even the difference?
Because she admires Usagi for coming to a better solution for dealing with Chaos than she did. That's nothing like being jealous of someone.

...and most Pure-Hearted Senshi in the Galaxy”)
Did you get this from a bad batch of fansubs or something?


A twist just for the sake of there being a twist and for shock value doesn’t suddenly make it good writing. The twist first has to have proper set-up beforehand and actually make sense, otherwise it just comes off as contrived.
It was set up.
 
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Apr 1, 2020
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#69
Setup of "there might be something behind Galaxia?" Yes
Setup of "Let the audience feel relieved and ok with her murdering all the senshi?" NO.

As for the manga, the setup wasn't so good, but the conclusion was big bang, sure.
 

Zhortac

Aurorae Lunares
Oct 12, 2011
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zhortac.deviantart.com
#70
I kinda agree, especially with the fact the anime kept the fact she had killed all live in their universe, save for her and Sailor Moon (and for some reason, not killing the Starlights...).
The manga has more reason to feel for her, since she's pretty much watching helplessly while her body is doing everything, and she wanted to actually die because of it.
Then again, if Toei had any idea wtf they were doing with anything, they wouldn't have a mountain of disappointment over the decades...
 

MariaTenebre

Systema Solare
Jul 22, 2009
5,182
597
665
#71
It has nothing to do with her modern day's killing.

Nehellenia's ppl were nobody to the audience, they have little personality and popularity, like only very little screentime. It's very hard for ppl to feel really bad for them that much. When they were restored, then everything is fine.


The senshi were different, they were all around regular cast, loved by so many ppl. The Inner's death in the first season shocked so many ppl because we love them.

If someone kills them, of course their supporters would want the foe to pay heavily, just like the DD girls and Eudial. Till today I still feel that way.




Because it was shown that way.



Chaos was only mentioned, without much clear influence shown until the last moment. He wasn't a real "character" in ppl's eyes, so it's impossible to switch the anger to him.

If you want to let the audience blame him, you need to make it clear like showing Galaxia being possessed in the beginning, or showing Galaxia's true personality much much earlier, to show her struggle, that's how you handle a plot.

I've mentioned Bucky the Winter Soldier before. He was shown to be Steve's good pal, suffered such brainwash, Hydra was also seen as a main threat. Yet still many ppl feel angry when the scene of him killing Tony's parents were shown, and side with Tony.

Imagine if we had none of this setup, having him killing important characters, then reveal that he was good in the last moment, how much ppl would even feel bad for him?

It's very important to understand that you can't just write something good or bad, you need to let the audience feel it. Somtimes killing a thousand ppl doesn't shock as much as killing one.

Again I'm not arguing about is she evil or is Nehellenia much worse, but about how it was presented.
And that matters? Just because they were no one to the audience dosen't mean their killings weren't awful. In fact it is even worse because these people were HER subjects. Also Elizabeth Bathory is by no means modern.

Also the difference is the D.D. Girls and Eudial did what they did of their own free will where as Sailor Galaxia was possessed and it was forshadowed that she was the legendary soldier that sealed Chaos away and unlike Eudial and the D.D. Girls Sailor Galaxia when she was cleansed of Chaos made up for the past by returning the lives she stole.

It makes no logical sense for people to want Sailor Galaxia to "pay" for her crimes since she wasn't even responsible and I would feel the same for Bucky. Also I would regard Chaos as a Feminine Deity not a masculine one.
 
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Apr 1, 2020
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#72
And that matters? Just because they were no one to the audience dosen't mean their killings weren't awful. In fact it is even worse because these people were HER subjects. Also Elizabeth Bathory is by no means modern.
Of course it matters, the audience are not gonna feel bad for them as much as the beloved senshi, it's how human being works. It's totally different to kill a beloved popular character and some random nobody.
Imagine the DD girls killed 4 random cameo characters, is it going to shock ppl as much as they did to the Inners? No.
Is it the same when Eudial killed Michiru and she/others killing random ppl for their Pure Heart? No.

Also the difference is the D.D. Girls and Eudial did what they did of their own free will where as Sailor Galaxia was possessed and it was forshadowed that she was the legendary soldier that sealed Chaos away and unlike Eudial and the D.D. Girls Sailor Galaxia when she was cleansed of Chaos made up for the past by returning the lives she stole.
Again Chaos was not shown well, all we saw is Galaxia there. There were some hints but it was wayy too little to establish Chaos as a real character or menace. How is the audience gonna switch their anger?

Like I said, if in MCU we only got little hints about HYDRA and saw Bucky killing many important character, will the audience say "hi it's ok" ? No, even after showing so much, quite a few ppl still side with Tony. And to be fair many of us would do the same have we been in such position.

To let the audience accept it, either not let Galaxia do it, or show the presence of Chaos much earlier and obvious.

It makes no logical sense for people to want Sailor Galaxia to "pay" for her crimes since she wasn't even responsible and I would feel the same for Bucky. Also I would regard Chaos as a Feminine Deity not a masculine one.
There is sense: You don't just state things, you need to present it well to the audience to make it acceptable.

Winter Soldier is a good example yet still many ppl think the same as Tony.

Human beings are like that. And that's why storytellers cannot just base the plot on facts. You simply say "he killed millions" is powerless compare to showing a good beloved character get killed. This is the magic of storytelling, you could even show a villain being beloved if you focus on his good side and put his crime offscreen.
 
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