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 Post subject: Had Takeuchi Naoko Created SM today
PostPosted: Tue Oct 25, 2005 11:18 pm 
[Reopened thread after it was lost]

I don't want to repeat every word I said in my lost post, just read the "In Search of New Planets" in one of the most recent issue of the Time mag, it concerns with the heated debate on the definition of "planet" within and without the scientific community, triggered by recent astronomical discoveries. The implication of the results of this debate for the SM world could be the deletion/creation of some senshi characters.

And Antie had taken a good effort in responding my post by stating the current state of events in details. I originally wanted to respond to you later but your post was lost together with my original thread.

*Still hope that my original thread could be recovered*


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 25, 2005 11:29 pm 
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Just a guess here, but it would be that Naoko Takeuchi would stick with the names of the planets as she had learned them in school as a young girl!
She is, after all, a manga artist/writer, not a full time astronomer. :wink:

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 26, 2005 2:17 am 
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There are some things that we should consider.

1. This solar system officially still has nine planets. The International Astronomy Union, which is the organization that decides what gets to be a planet, still hasn't made Sedna, Xena, Quaoar, and those other objects planets. If objects are to be considered planets, then that would be determined by the public. In that case, they would be "planets," but not entirely in the same way Mercury, Earth, Pluto, et cetera, are.

2. No proposal to change the status of Pluto as the ninth planet in the solar system has been made by any Division, Commission or Working Group of the IAU responsible for solar system science. In other words, Pluto is still officially a planet. If Pluto is not to be considered a planet, then that would be determined by the public.

3. The IAU still doesn't have an official definition of the word planet. That's probably one of the reasons that Sedna and the others haven't been made into planets yet. Perhaps the IAU will officially make a distinction between the "traditional planets" (Mercury to Pluto) and the "official astronomical planets" (with a technical definition that is relevant to predetermined size limits). They might even coin a whole new word, perhaps planes, which is a Latin variant of planet.

If Ms. Takeuchi first worked on her BSSM story today, there might be a Sailor Sedna, a Sailor Xena, and a Sailor Quaoar, but perhaps not. Nemesis is officially a planet in the anime and manga, but we weren't shown a sailor soldier of Nemesis. (Nothing in the anime and manga precludes the existence of a Sailor Nemesis. The manga does imply that "chosen" celestial bodies have their own representatives: sailor soldiers, et cetera.)

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 26, 2005 2:49 am 
Wow! How could you do that, Antie? You keep logs of your posts for such circumstances?

Although I've said I won't go into details about the Time article in my original (lost) post, I'd just like to point out there's one (crazy?) guy within the scientific community who proposes that any celestial objects, regardless of sizes, directly orbiting the sun should be defined as planets. His rationale is that any definition involving sizes is arbitrary (which he has a point, though). If his definition was ultimately accepted in the scientific circles and by the public, then we could have astromical number of senshi just within the Solar System (though this could be good or bad, depending on your preference).

I can't recall his name and I'm too lazy to check. Check that article if you want to know.


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 26, 2005 4:53 am 
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Hmm, I could see her including Sailor Sedna etc. maybe as rogue senshi or something...but I suppose if there's no Sailor Nemesis then maybe not.

A Sailor Charon would be fun but I think Naoko had that option back then too and just decided not to go that route.


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 26, 2005 11:45 pm 
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I think that you also have to keep in mind who Naoko is primarily writing for: kids, aged from seven to about 12, and I doubt many kids would know about Sedna, Xena, Quaoar, etc. Sure, they know about the nine official planets, but everybody is aware of those. Something scientifically correct at this point would just be way over their heads, especially when these objects (for lack of a better word) arent even officially planets. Had SM been written nowadays, even if she did include them it would end up being too confusing for the kids anyway, leaving them wondering wether they are planets or not, and they arent even ready for the real answer because it hasn't even been determined yet.

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PostPosted: Thu Oct 27, 2005 12:21 am 
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Hmm. I thought this thread might be about the differences in styles, technology, general ways of life etc. would change the manga/anime.

But this is interesting, also. ^^

I'd have to agree with bewitchingchild about the planet discrepancies among the youngins. Besides, Sailor Xena just makes me wonder if there would be a Tuxedo Gabriel Kamen sidekick. XD

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PostPosted: Thu Oct 27, 2005 12:37 am 
With your inputs on this topic, I think I can say that even if SM was created when the newly discovered objects orbiting the sun were officially recognized as planets, Takeuchi still might not include them as senshi characters, as there have been precedents of not doing so. (Though I like the idea of rouge senshi if she did include them.)

A more difficult situation would be that the objects were not recognized as such with Pluto. There has already been at least one planetarium removing Pluto from its exhibits of the planets of the Solar System today, though its director, himself a scientist, did so in a quite high-handed way (in my opinion) and, of course, not without controversy. You can just imagine the reaction of some parents and teachers (bewitchingchild has shown why in the above post). But he still sticks to what he thinks is right, and I don't know whether this is just the beginning (as the history of science has shown) or just an isolated joke of a rebellious scientist.

For the SM world, the deletion of the Sailor Pluto character could have major repercussions to the R and S plotlines.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Oct 27, 2005 1:14 am 
[Sorry for this double post because pheona went ahead of me when I was still typing my last post (really slowly :P )]

Quote:
Tuxedo Gabriel Kamen


:lol: Would she hide the rose in her cleavage?

-

Contrary to what it might seem to be, this topic is not just concerned with pure astronomy. It also involves a complex interplay of various fields like cognitive psychology (e.g. how we classify things), social psychology (e.g. rivalries within the scientific circles and even in the public domain), culture (e.g. mythology), philosophy, religion (abeit to a lesser extent), etc. And, as pheona has hinted, the shape of the SM manga/anime would be the result such interplay.


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 27, 2005 7:21 am 
[Errata]

After rereading the Time article, I've to made some amendments to my post immediately following Antie's:

(1) "any celestial objects" should be amended to "any spheretical celestial objects".
(2) "astronomical number of senshi" should be amended to "a few dozens of senshi".

lol


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 31, 2005 10:17 pm 
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Pluto seems to be a planet mainly because of tradition. Someone once said that Pluto is a planet in much the same way that Europe is a continent (instead of part of a continent named Eurasia).

I find it strange that the The Nine Planets Solar System Tour shows "The -Nine- Ten Planets," where the Nine is slashed out.
http://www.nineplanets.org/

Rika-Chicchi wrote:
There has already been at least one planetarium removing Pluto from its exhibits of the planets of the Solar System today, though its director, himself a scientist, did so in a quite high-handed way (in my opinion) and, of course, not without controversy.

That's very strange, considering it's still a planet.

Rika-Chicchi wrote:
But he still sticks to what he thinks is right, and I don't know whether this is just the beginning (as the history of science has shown) or just an isolated joke of a rebellious scientist.

It seems to me that the guy is being a rebellious scientist.

Rika-Chicchi wrote:
For the SM world, the deletion of the Sailor Pluto character could have major repercussions to the R and S plotlines.

Sure, but I'm glad that we don't have to worry about that. :)

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PostPosted: Tue Nov 01, 2005 1:23 am 
Antie, you're quite right about the tradition thing - is Australia an island, maybe just an island of Oceania? I'm quite sure that the upholding of tradition is an important one among the diverse arguments of this debate. And thank you for the link, the info seems to match the Time article.

Quote:
That's very strange


Yeah, the official position about Pluto still hasn't changed yet. Maybe this guy wants to make himself a revolutionary hero in the history of astronomy?

And we don't have to worry about the R and S plotlines, I don't think Takeuchi would alter her story even if Pluto got booted from the planets club today.


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 Post subject: Re:
PostPosted: Wed Oct 11, 2017 2:12 pm 
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Sadly it wouldn't be that great. With the exclusion SuperS and Stars as a whole the first 3 seasons rocked. :cool:

Anime was revolutionary during the 90's.

Diaphanus wrote:
Rika-Chicchi wrote:
But he still sticks to what he thinks is right, and I don't know whether this is just the beginning (as the history of science has shown) or just an isolated joke of a rebellious scientist.

It seems to me that the guy is being a rebellious scientist.


I agree. The planet has an atmosphere and 2 moons. :o

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 Post subject: Re: Had Takeuchi Naoko Created SM today
PostPosted: Wed Oct 11, 2017 4:54 pm 
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If she had created it today, it would not have been as successful because TOEI doesn't invest as much money in anime as it did in the 90s.

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 Post subject: Re: Had Takeuchi Naoko Created SM today
PostPosted: Wed Oct 11, 2017 7:05 pm 
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Clow wrote:
If she had created it today, it would not have been as successful because TOEI doesn't invest as much money in anime as it did in the 90s.

And she might no longer have that "fire" during her younger days in creating a large fictional universe/timeline, the worldview/philosophy w/i it, & a whole set of character inter-relationships at her age now. She might even know that herself, & hence prefer to simply continue taking the fruits of what she achieved in the past.

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 Post subject: Re: Had Takeuchi Naoko Created SM today
PostPosted: Wed Oct 11, 2017 10:11 pm 
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The hell is with these old thread bumps lately? This one is 12 years old... :orly:

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 Post subject: Re: Had Takeuchi Naoko Created SM today
PostPosted: Wed Oct 11, 2017 10:25 pm 
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NJ_ wrote:
The hell is with these old thread bumps lately? This one is 12 years old... :orly:


yeah and Rikas name in the older posts is black :orly: :?

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 Post subject: Re: Had Takeuchi Naoko Created SM today
PostPosted: Wed Oct 11, 2017 11:02 pm 
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Ryo Urawa wrote:
NJ_ wrote:
The hell is with these old thread bumps lately? This one is 12 years old... :orly:


yeah and Rikas name in the older posts is black :orly: :?

lol I wasn't an actual forum member here back then (guests were allowed to register their usernames & post here at the time, but they didn't have the full membership rights).

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 Post subject: Re: Had Takeuchi Naoko Created SM today
PostPosted: Thu Oct 12, 2017 12:13 am 
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NJ_ wrote:
The hell is with these old thread bumps lately? This one is 12 years old... :orly:


We should ask rgveda99 along with his obsessions with Naoko's cars.

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 Post subject: Re: Had Takeuchi Naoko Created SM today
PostPosted: Thu Oct 12, 2017 12:38 am 
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Again I don't think that if the series was created today that Naoko would not include Sailor Pluto. I mean she has other non planetary Senshi. I mean the main character is Senshi of the Earth's Moon and we also have the Asteroid Senshi as well.

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 Post subject: Re: Had Takeuchi Naoko Created SM today
PostPosted: Thu Oct 12, 2017 7:02 am 
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NJ_ wrote:
The hell is with these old thread bumps lately? This one is 12 years old... :orly:


So what? There's no law or forum rule which defines how long a topic may stay open legally, or is it? :unsure:

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 Post subject: Re: Had Takeuchi Naoko Created SM today
PostPosted: Thu Oct 12, 2017 1:40 pm 
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Rika-Chicchi wrote:
And she might no longer have that "fire" during her younger days in creating a large fictional universe/timeline, the worldview/philosophy w/i it, & a whole set of character inter-relationships at her age now. She might even know that herself, & hence prefer to simply continue taking the fruits of what she achieved in the past.


I don't believe that at all.

I think Naoko has the ability to come up with something even more extraordinary.

I believe people become wiser, more intelligent and mature as they age.

Now, does Naoko want to be a mangaka? I don't know.

I think motherhood and other factors of which we may not be aware may have shifted her priorities.

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 Post subject: Re: Had Takeuchi Naoko Created SM today
PostPosted: Thu Oct 12, 2017 2:23 pm 
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NJ_ wrote:
The hell is with these old thread bumps lately? This one is 12 years old... :orly:

This is a serious discussion forum. We take our time to think about what we are going to say, even if it takes us a few years. :o

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 Post subject: Re: Had Takeuchi Naoko Created SM today
PostPosted: Thu Oct 12, 2017 6:10 pm 
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Clow wrote:
Rika-Chicchi wrote:
And she might no longer have that "fire" during her younger days in creating a large fictional universe/timeline, the worldview/philosophy w/i it, & a whole set of character inter-relationships at her age now. She might even know that herself, & hence prefer to simply continue taking the fruits of what she achieved in the past.


I don't believe that at all.

I think Naoko has the ability to come up with something even more extraordinary.

I believe people become wiser, more intelligent and mature as they age.

Agreed, but I was talking about her "fire," i.e. her creative ambition or intense motivation/desire to build up another story, not that her intelligence has degenerated at her current age, which should be quite the opposite, like what you've said. :wink: And in any case, that's just meant to be a possible scenario (hence my using the word "might"), not a fact, as I don't really know her present situation & state of mind.

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 Post subject: Re: Had Takeuchi Naoko Created SM today
PostPosted: Thu Oct 12, 2017 7:41 pm 
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Maraviollantes wrote:
NJ_ wrote:
The hell is with these old thread bumps lately? This one is 12 years old... :orly:

This is a serious discussion forum. We take our time to think about what we are going to say, even if it takes us a few years. :o


I'm sorry but that just made me laugh hysterically :lol: :lol: :lol:

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 Post subject: Re: Had Takeuchi Naoko Created SM today
PostPosted: Thu Oct 12, 2017 7:44 pm 
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Rika-Chicchi wrote:
Clow wrote:
Rika-Chicchi wrote:
And she might no longer have that "fire" during her younger days in creating a large fictional universe/timeline, the worldview/philosophy w/i it, & a whole set of character inter-relationships at her age now. She might even know that herself, & hence prefer to simply continue taking the fruits of what she achieved in the past.


I don't believe that at all.

I think Naoko has the ability to come up with something even more extraordinary.

I believe people become wiser, more intelligent and mature as they age.

Agreed, but I was talking about her "fire," i.e. her creative ambition or intense motivation/desire to build up another story, not that her intelligence has degenerated at her current age, which should be quite the opposite, like what you've said. :wink: And in any case, that's just meant to be a possible scenario (hence my using the word "might"), not a fact, as I don't really know her present situation & state of mind.


Yes, of course. :)

I know for a fact that if I ever become a billionaire, I won't feel as motivated to "make a point."

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