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 Post subject: Re: Is Sailor Moon Anti-Capitalist?
PostPosted: Sun Nov 12, 2017 7:48 am 
Aurorae Lunares
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In all seriousness, I find it very apolitical. It is not capitalist, but not anti-capitalist either.

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 Post subject: Re: Is Sailor Moon Anti-Capitalist?
PostPosted: Sun Nov 12, 2017 10:12 am 
Luna Nova
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Lord Mala wrote:
In all seriousness, I find it very apolitical. It is not capitalist, but not anti-capitalist either.

I concur; you've captured in two sentences about 87.23% of what I said over several long-winded paragraphs. :)


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 Post subject: Re: Is Sailor Moon Anti-Capitalist?
PostPosted: Sun Nov 12, 2017 1:14 pm 
Galaxias
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templariuS wrote:
Being rich or love having fashion costumes is not a contradiction for being anti-capitalist. Anti-capitalism questions the means of production and the concentration of power in a small elite, not people having good lives and style or fashion lol! A German left-wing party has a slogan saying luxury for all, for example.

I think they have a small rejoinder somewhere in their political program explaining that by "all" they mean only all members of their party who have reached a certain rank, not all humans and not even all German citizens. Even if humans today thoroughly exhaust all planet resources, that still won't be enough to give everyone their own mansion, a helicopter, and a sport car. There just aren't enough metal, oil, and even space to place all those mansions and helicopter launchpads on this planet for everyone. The very idea of luxury items is based on a premise that a small amount of people exploits the rest of their fellow humans who never, even theoretically, can own the same luxury items.

Lord Mala wrote:
In all seriousness, I find it very apolitical. It is not capitalist, but not anti-capitalist either.

Care to explain why? Just making a statement contradicting almost everything that have been discussing above without explaining any of your reasons doesn't contribute much to the discussion, I think. Like, a girl captures control over entire planet, builds a giant palace for herself (that is, makes other people to build it for her - I doubt Usagi or any other senshi personally participated in any construction works), kills everyone opposing her rule, and you think all of that is very apolitical?

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 Post subject: Re: Is Sailor Moon Anti-Capitalist?
PostPosted: Sun Nov 12, 2017 1:23 pm 
Luna Nova
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Well, to clarify my own statement of 87.some-odd percent, that implies 12.some-odd percent difference in opinion. The gist of my incoherent ramble was that at few points (in the 90s anime at least) does it ever seem like this issue is consciously or implicitly addressed in any way; the biggest example I could think of centered around one of the Rando characters from a single episode of SuperS (Kamoi), from which I came away with 'mildly anti-caiptalist, at least as far as treatment of the starving/those who cannot afford food, even if they are still attempting to contribute to the arts'.

But I don't think it's very conscious of pro-capitalism or anti-capitalism imagery, nor drawing clear connections. Just sorta seems like almost every character in the entire show regardless of faction or plot importance is wealthy and has fancy stuff, without much time spent on implying classism or denying/endorsing distribution of resources and wealth, because everybody (besides Kamoi in that one episode) just sorta... has it already. Unless I'm forgetting more relevant randos.

I also basically speculated that Naoko Takeushi wasn't thinking through captialist/communist impilcations beyond "shiny things are cool, let's include all the shiny things, wish I had one (or maybe I can buy one soon)". I can't be sure of that, but that was just my vague impression.


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 Post subject: Re: Is Sailor Moon Anti-Capitalist?
PostPosted: Sun Nov 12, 2017 6:20 pm 
Luna
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Maraviollantes wrote:
Care to explain why? Just making a statement contradicting almost everything that have been discussing above without explaining any of your reasons doesn't contribute much to the discussion, I think. Like, a girl captures control over entire planet, builds a giant palace for herself (that is, makes other people to build it for her - I doubt Usagi or any other senshi personally participated in any construction works), kills everyone opposing her rule, and you think all of that is very apolitical?



And you are waaaaaay overthinking. Don’t think for a second Takeuchi gave it anymore thought than “Usagi was a princess and in the future she’s the Queen”


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 Post subject: Re: Is Sailor Moon Anti-Capitalist?
PostPosted: Sun Nov 12, 2017 7:06 pm 
Galaxias
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LifeGaveMeLemons wrote:
Don’t think for a second Takeuchi gave it anymore thought than “Usagi was a princess and in the future she’s the Queen”

Maybe. Maybe she also thought "Usagi was killing youma for the greater good, and in the future she will kill her human political opponents for the greater good", without giving it any further thought. Does not thinking about it much somehow make such actions apolitical?

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 Post subject: Re: Is Sailor Moon Anti-Capitalist?
PostPosted: Sun Nov 12, 2017 7:08 pm 
Aurorae Lunares
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I think Lemons is just talking about it from the author's perspective. Anything can have a political message if you're looking for it. It's one thing to say "I can see anti-capitalist sentiments in Sailor Moon, look at this for example" and it's another to say "These examples are proof that it was what the author intended." :)

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 Post subject: Re: Is Sailor Moon Anti-Capitalist?
PostPosted: Sun Nov 12, 2017 7:21 pm 
Columnae Creationis
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The political economy in the Sailor Moon universe of both the past & future always feels feudalistic to me. lol

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