Sailor Moon Forum

International Sailor Moon Online Community

* FAQ    * Search   * Login 
* Rss  * Register
It is currently Fri Nov 24, 2017 11:03 am

All times are UTC




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 53 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2
Author Message
 Post subject: Re: LGBT Sailor Moon Fans
PostPosted: Mon Mar 28, 2016 8:55 am 
Galaxias
Galaxias
User avatar
Years of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membership
Joined: Jan 03, 2006
Posts: 10108
Location: Embelyon
Neon Genesis wrote:
Back to the discussion of LGBT Sailor Moon fans, I wonder if anyone has done a survey on how many Sailor Moon fans identify as LGBT.

Over half, according to a poll here: http://www.sailormoonforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=22095

_________________
Image
http://shoujocity.com


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: LGBT Sailor Moon Fans
PostPosted: Tue Mar 29, 2016 6:32 pm 
Aurorae Lunares
Aurorae Lunares
User avatar
Years of membershipYears of membership
Joined: Oct 31, 2015
Posts: 1816
Clow wrote:
To be perfectly honest, the main reason that Sailor Moon isn't among my favorite anime titles of all times is because of its depiction of gay men. While I am glad that transgender individuals and lesbian women can identify with Sailor Moon, I, as a gay man, cannot. All of the gay men depicted in both the anime and manga are either villains or reflect stereotypes that I do not associate myself with.

I love most of CLAMP's works because their works are as innovative and brilliant as Sailor Moon, and they depict gay men in a much more progressive light than Sailor Moon does. Examples include Seishirō and Subaru (Tokyo Babylon), Kamui and Fuuma (X), Touya and Yukito (Cardcaptor Sakura, Tsubasa Reservoir Chronicles), the list goes on and on...
I'm also a big fan of CLAMP. I love how positive and nonchalantly they portray LGBT characters too. Like no one in CCS land ever makes a huge deal about Touya and Yukito being gay. Sakura is more
Spoiler: show
upset that Yukito didn't return her feelings than she is about him being gay. But she's still very supportive of him and I love that cute scene where she tells Yukito he'll give Touya a piece of her mind if he ever mistreats him.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: LGBT Sailor Moon Fans
PostPosted: Tue Mar 29, 2016 7:30 pm 
Aurorae Lunares
Aurorae Lunares
Years of membershipYears of membershipYears of membership
Joined: Aug 16, 2014
Posts: 1438
Location: USA
Gender: female
Other: conservative
Neon Genesis wrote:
Cognitive dissonance is weird like that. I have a lot of fundamentalist Christian friends who have conservative views on LGBT rights but a lot of them still went to go see Elton John last weekend when he performed a live show in my town last week. My mother is economically liberal socially conservative Democrat and she still has conservative views on LGBT rights but she's a big Ellen Degeneres fan and I managed to convert her into being a Sailor Moon fan. She was a bit weirded out by Zoisite and Kunzite being all lovey dovey at first and she was seriously confused by Haruka's gender and I had to explain it to her that they're gay and that Haruka is a crossdresser. I guess bigoted Sailor Moon fans are able to reconcile it with their views because the 90s anime never really shows that much physical contact between LGBT characters and it portrays LGBT characters in a 90s stereotyped way. I imagine some of them are also probably the types of fans who only watch the DiC dub of Sailor Moon. T This makes me wonder how this small percentage of homophobic fans, especially my mother will react to season three of Crystal, if they keep that scene where Haruka kisses Usagi.
My churches don't agree with homosexuality,but lot of us watch shows with gay characters.Lot of us also watch shows watch shows with magic.Lot of us really don't care if a character is gay or not.(I just care if a character is well written)None of my churches hate Gay people. Lot people in my church community just pray for them.. I know there are extremist out there .( Ones that we are very upset by)But what I witness,were not going to disown a show because of a gay character. And were not going to treat a person like crap because there gay. To answer your question,most of us with the kiss thing. Would probably just would be okay with it, And keep watching the show.

As for Gay Characters in Sailor Moon in the classic anime. To me the LGQBT characters there were very stereotypical,and fetish size. Especially Uranus,ad Neptune. Why in the anime they flirted a lot i. In the manga it was clear they were together,and they didn't show it by flirting. Which I think it was good. I like when media any kinda couple gay,or straight. Show them in love,and care for one another .Without showing them flirt.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: LGBT Sailor Moon Fans
PostPosted: Tue Mar 29, 2016 8:01 pm 
Planeta
Planeta
User avatar
Years of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membership
Joined: Jul 29, 2012
Posts: 3544
Gender: male
Other: CLAMP PR
Neon Genesis wrote:
I'm also a big fan of CLAMP. I love how positive and nonchalantly they portray LGBT characters too.


They're pretty vocal about their support for LGBT rights --and are also known for using their works to criticize Japanese society for being too homogeneous and for its discrimination against Asians from other countries.

_________________
Visit Clow's shop


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: LGBT Sailor Moon Fans
PostPosted: Tue Mar 29, 2016 9:44 pm 
Solaris Luna
Solaris Luna
User avatar
Years of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membership
Joined: Jun 06, 2006
Posts: 2654
Location: NJ
Gender: Male
Another thing, Takeuchi uses the term "okama" a few times in her manga. It's not exactly the most politically correct term for gay men. She also seemed to want the Amazon Trio to be very effeminate and well... stereotypical.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: LGBT Sailor Moon Fans
PostPosted: Tue Mar 29, 2016 9:50 pm 
Planeta
Planeta
User avatar
Years of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membership
Joined: Jul 29, 2012
Posts: 3544
Gender: male
Other: CLAMP PR
Umino wrote:
Another thing, Takeuchi uses the term "okama" a few times in her manga. It's not exactly the most politically correct term for gay men. She also seemed to want the Amazon Trio to be very effeminate and well... stereotypical.


Yup.

_________________
Visit Clow's shop


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: LGBT Sailor Moon Fans
PostPosted: Tue Mar 29, 2016 10:08 pm 
Columnae Creationis
Columnae Creationis
User avatar
Years of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membership
Joined: May 07, 2009
Posts: 37677
Gender: Male
Umino wrote:
Another thing, Takeuchi uses the term "okama" a few times in her manga. It's not exactly the most politically correct term for gay men. She also seemed to want the Amazon Trio to be very effeminate and well... stereotypical.

In a sense, she was just mirroring how the Japanese society saw it at the time. :)

_________________
 
Image

Avatar courtesy of ayaka502 (enhanced by Senji-kun)
My J-pop corner


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: LGBT Sailor Moon Fans
PostPosted: Tue Mar 29, 2016 11:10 pm 
Solaris Luna
Solaris Luna
User avatar
Years of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membership
Joined: Apr 20, 2012
Posts: 2082
Location: Texas
Gender: Male
Gay Sailor Moon fan here. :) I'm sort of inbetween on the LGBT characters in Sailor Moon. They made quite a positive impact on me similar to Salem Saberhagen, but I certainly have my issues too. (the girls homophobia with Jupiter, Fish Eye hitting on a boy, etc.) They don't hold up as well nowadays, but I do appreciate they took a risk in trying to include some positive representation in anime.

Umino wrote:
Another thing, Takeuchi uses the term "okama" a few times in her manga. It's not exactly the most politically correct term for gay men. She also seemed to want the Amazon Trio to be very effeminate and well... stereotypical.

If Crystal does the Dream arc, I'm really curious to see how they'll handle the Trio. :P


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: LGBT Sailor Moon Fans
PostPosted: Wed Mar 30, 2016 4:12 pm 
Columnae Creationis
Columnae Creationis
User avatar
Years of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membership
Joined: May 07, 2009
Posts: 37677
Gender: Male
The Blizzard Prince wrote:
Umino wrote:
Another thing, Takeuchi uses the term "okama" a few times in her manga. It's not exactly the most politically correct term for gay men. She also seemed to want the Amazon Trio to be very effeminate and well... stereotypical.

If Crystal does the Dream arc, I'm really curious to see how they'll handle the Trio. :P

They might still largely stick to the manga, I'd guess. :)

_________________
 
Image

Avatar courtesy of ayaka502 (enhanced by Senji-kun)
My J-pop corner


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: LGBT Sailor Moon Fans
PostPosted: Mon Apr 11, 2016 3:00 am 
Bitten by Chibiusa 5 months ago
inactive
Joined: Mar 18, 2012
Posts: 19
Location: Los Angeles <3
Yes I'm a gay african american Sailor Moon fan since the mid 90s.

I do agree with one poster saying you get teased for the shows you watched if you went to elementary school in the 90s.

Boys who watched Power Rangers were called babies, and boys who watched Sailor Moon were called the f a g word,

and really boys who watched Dragon Ball Z or Pokemon weren't exempt either.

I also agree with posters saying there are homophobic sailor moon fans as well sadly and try to evade any gay discussion.

They forget that Zoisite and Kunzite are gay. Haruka and Michuru are lesbian, Fiore is gay, Zirconia is lesbian, etc.

Sailor Moon has gay characters and gay themes, and sadly we as fans cant unite and accept that. Like on the Sailor Moon wikipedia article. all the LGBT support topics were removed.

I agree to disagree on the gay characters are protrayed bad.

Yes they are all mostly villains and clowns, but

Fisheye a gay man, who was one the villains in the dream arc, actually felt remorse for his actions and wanted to become human, and saved Sailor Moon and asked her to make him and Tigers Eye human being after a Lemure killed Hawks Eye. So, agree to disagree.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: LGBT Sailor Moon Fans
PostPosted: Mon Apr 11, 2016 4:18 am 
Stella
Stella
User avatar
Years of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membership
Joined: Jul 22, 2009
Posts: 4397
Nonoko wrote:
Yes I'm a gay african american Sailor Moon fan since the mid 90s.

I do agree with one poster saying you get teased for the shows you watched if you went to elementary school in the 90s.

Boys who watched Power Rangers were called babies, and boys who watched Sailor Moon were called the f a g word,

and really boys who watched Dragon Ball Z or Pokemon weren't exempt either.

I also agree with posters saying there are homophobic sailor moon fans as well sadly and try to evade any gay discussion.

They forget that Zoisite and Kunzite are gay. Haruka and Michuru are lesbian, Fiore is gay, Zirconia is lesbian, etc.

Sailor Moon has gay characters and gay themes, and sadly we as fans cant unite and accept that. Like on the Sailor Moon wikipedia article. all the LGBT support topics were removed.

I agree to disagree on the gay characters are protrayed bad.

Yes they are all mostly villains and clowns, but

Fisheye a gay man, who was one the villains in the dream arc, actually felt remorse for his actions and wanted to become human, and saved Sailor Moon and asked her to make him and Tigers Eye human being after a Lemure killed Hawks Eye. So, agree to disagree.

Zirconia doesn't seem like a lesbian to me. Actually in the series Zirconia is an aspect of Queen Nehellenia stemming from her fear of growing old. This is why she is so affectionate towards Nehellenia's beauty because she represents her youth and why Nehellenia is repulsed by Zirconia.

_________________
.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: LGBT Sailor Moon Fans
PostPosted: Sat Apr 16, 2016 4:59 pm 
Bitten by Chibiusa 18 months ago
inactive
User avatar
Joined: Feb 09, 2016
Posts: 11
Gender: female
Well, I never realized I was bisexual until I watched Sailor Moon back in '08.
I was pretty young during that time. (Like 5th-6th grade) But I always had feelings for the same and opposite sex back then. I think watching Haruka and Michiru's relationship on-screen really helped me come to terms with it.

So, I have to thank this series for helping me discover parts of myself that I would've never thought of looking into :love:


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: LGBT Sailor Moon Fans
PostPosted: Thu May 05, 2016 4:48 am 
Columnae Creationis
Columnae Creationis
User avatar
Years of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membership
Joined: Aug 31, 2011
Posts: 14394
Location: The Nostromo
Gender: Male
Other: Gay.
I actually didn't know what gay was until high school, but I am a gay male who fluctuates on the gender spectrum, so, I think I identify more with characters like Usagi and Minako than some others. My personal interpretation leans towards the "everyone is bi, except Haruka and Michiru," due to a combination of Ikuhara's influence as well as Takeuchi's own writing and art.
I'm not sure if it helped me in childhood, though I always wanted to be a Sailor Soldier over Tuxedo Mask, but it did help me more in high school.

_________________
Image
avatar pic created by a good friend.
Check out my podcast!


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: LGBT Sailor Moon Fans
PostPosted: Wed May 11, 2016 3:08 am 
Aurorae Lunares
Aurorae Lunares
User avatar
Years of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membership
Joined: Dec 20, 2011
Posts: 1030
Location: New York
Gender: Male
Nonoko wrote:
Yes I'm a gay african american Sailor Moon fan since the mid 90s.

I do agree with one poster saying you get teased for the shows you watched if you went to elementary school in the 90s.

Boys who watched Power Rangers were called babies, and boys who watched Sailor Moon were called the f a g word,

and really boys who watched Dragon Ball Z or Pokemon weren't exempt either.


I had very similar experiences. It's funny because I think lots of kids watched shows like that (or other random shows) and just didn't say anything.

I remember Power Rangers was the "coolest" thing in kindergarten (and before!), but by the time I was in first grade just a year later, it was suddenly for "babies" and you'd get teased if you expressed interest in it. Sailor Moon was even worse because it was basically Power Rangers for girls. I remember keeping these interests to myself for *years* and it wasn't until high school that I was comfortable expressing the fact that I was into these types of shows. I remember in senior year of high school, I had a Power Rangers T-shirt I wanted to wear, and even though I had a LOT of friends in high school and I didn't experience any bullying after middle school, I was still afraid of what people would think. Thankfully, I got a lot of great reactions, and that was when I opened up about how much I was into these types of shows.

From my experience, boys who watched DBZ and Pokemon actually WERE exempt from teasing. Everyone at my elementary school was into Pokemon. EVERYONE. DBZ wasn't as popular, but you certainly wouldn't get teased for watching it because it was supposed to be really badass or whatever.

So many memories. :)

_________________
Dracula loves Sailor Moon


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: LGBT Sailor Moon Fans
PostPosted: Thu Jun 02, 2016 4:11 am 
Luna
Luna
Years of membershipYears of membershipYears of membership
Joined: Sep 06, 2014
Posts: 722
Gender: male
My favorite example of homophobia in the Sailor Moon fandom was "Prince Uranus"
because it was so ****ing ridiculous. Saying Haruka was a man in a past life doesn't make her and Michiru's relationship less gay now.


MariaTenebre wrote:
Well you can't control the reactions of children and again Japan is not so progressive on LGBT issues as anime leads us to believe. In some ways they are better then us in other ways they are worse .


It seems they're better at not trying to hide the existence of LGBT from kids (which is such a dumb cultural thing in America and I hate how kids entertainment like Disney will do double standards comments like "we don't deal with sexuality....Look at all these hetero romances!) but they're than the U.S at treating LGBT like actual people.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: LGBT Sailor Moon Fans
PostPosted: Fri Jun 03, 2016 6:49 am 
Stella
Stella
User avatar
Years of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membership
Joined: Jul 22, 2009
Posts: 4397
LifeGaveMeLemons wrote:
My favorite example of homophobia in the Sailor Moon fandom was "Prince Uranus"
because it was so ****ing ridiculous. Saying Haruka was a man in a past life doesn't make her and Michiru's relationship less gay now.


MariaTenebre wrote:
Well you can't control the reactions of children and again Japan is not so progressive on LGBT issues as anime leads us to believe. In some ways they are better then us in other ways they are worse .


It seems they're better at not trying to hide the existence of LGBT from kids (which is such a dumb cultural thing in America and I hate how kids entertainment like Disney will do double standards comments like "we don't deal with sexuality....Look at all these hetero romances!) but they're than the U.S at treating LGBT like actual people.

Yeah the Japanese are definitely better in regard that they do not hide the existence of LGBT characters from kids in that sense.

Oh and yeah I remember the Prince Uranus myth a classic example of early homophobia in the fandom. I believe Naoko Takeuchi was even asked about something related to this and she stated that Haruka has always been a girl and always will be a girl.

_________________
.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: LGBT Sailor Moon Fans
PostPosted: Sun Jun 05, 2016 3:40 am 
Luna Crescens
Luna Crescens
User avatar
Years of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membership
Joined: Sep 19, 2007
Posts: 232
Gender: male_LGBT
I wish that there was more LGBT male protagonists in @least SOME of the versions of SM that we in our universe have access to, (I'd very much love to see quite a bit more Mamoru X Motoki, &/or Mamoru X Fiore Yaoi, in @LEAST SOME VERSIONS OF SM)!!

(FYI, I'm a male who has somewhat of a preference for other males, romantically-speaking, although I DO like the opposite gender as well, (definitely as friends, although of course it depends on the individual), & I don't @this particular stage in my life, feel like becoming a biological father, in this universe)!!

_________________
SELENE/ENDYMION=SAILOR MOON/TUXEDO KAMEN!!KIRBYZELDA/NAYRU/WISDOMGANON/DIN/POWERLINK/FARORE/COURAGETRIFORCE ^!!NARUTOPOKEBALLFMAB/FMAImageImage


Last edited by Tuf Pic on Mon Jun 13, 2016 11:07 pm, edited 2 times in total.

Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: LGBT Sailor Moon Fans
PostPosted: Sun Jun 05, 2016 4:13 am 
Luna
Luna
Years of membershipYears of membershipYears of membership
Joined: Sep 06, 2014
Posts: 722
Gender: male
I already read Mamoru as a bit bi. Like, I can see
him "experimenting" As I recall he didn't take an issue with Fish Eye as a romantic partner because of his sex but because Fish Eye didn't have dreams (and because he was dating Usagi) in


Fiore was definitely subtextually gay and he at the very least, reformed and was only brainwashed.


The Starlight can be read as FTM transgender which would be positive male LGBT


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: LGBT Sailor Moon Fans
PostPosted: Sun Jun 05, 2016 6:48 pm 
Bitten by Chibiusa 18 months ago
inactive
User avatar
Joined: Feb 09, 2016
Posts: 11
Gender: female
LifeGaveMeLemons wrote:
I already read Mamoru as a bit bi. Like, I can see
him "experimenting" As I recall he didn't take an issue with Fish Eye as a romantic partner because of his sex but because Fish Eye didn't have dreams (and because he was dating Usagi) in


Fiore was definitely subtextually gay and he at the very least, reformed and was only brainwashed.


The Starlight can be read as FTM transgender which would be positive male LGBT


I can see Mamoru being bisexual.
Honestly I see every character on this show as bi unless stated/shown otherwise (Like Haruka,etc.)
Especially since it's based off of Greek mythology, and back in those days it was considered a "norm" to be bisexual.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: LGBT Sailor Moon Fans
PostPosted: Sun Jun 05, 2016 9:08 pm 
Luna
Luna
Years of membershipYears of membershipYears of membership
Joined: Sep 06, 2014
Posts: 722
Gender: male
Personally


Usagi is definetely bisexual in the manga, but in the anime she comes off just a tad homophobic. I think anime Usagi is straight but has some bisexual tendacies. Manga Usagi would definitely be down for a sapphic relationship if she wasn't with Mamoru. Anime Usagi...would maybe kiss a girl while drunk.


Nothing really suggest Ami is lesbian or bi. She's defnitely the Sailor Soldier most likely to have files of gay male porn on her computer though ^_^


Rei miiight be bi in the anime. She seemed to be attracted to Haruka even after the reveal and that one girl when Chibi Moon was introduced


Mako is probably, at least, bi curious


Minako is probably straight since Haruka's gender revealee deterred her from being further interested unlike Rei and Mako.


Jadeite is asexual, Nephrite is straight, Zoicite is gay, and Kunzite is pansexual (I think he is attracted to feminine beauty regardless of gender or sex. A more manly man wouldn't be his type)

Haruka is genderqueer who likes women and Michiru is probably pansexual (as an artist I see her being attracted to aesthetics not gender or genitals, she would love Haruka because Haruka is physically beautiful to her regardless of gender)


I'm probably thinking about this too much


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: LGBT Sailor Moon Fans
PostPosted: Sun Jun 12, 2016 2:59 am 
Aurorae Lunares
Aurorae Lunares
User avatar
Years of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membership
Joined: Dec 20, 2011
Posts: 1030
Location: New York
Gender: Male
Rei's "what you want most" sequence with a revived Eudial in one of the newer Crystal episodes seems to imply that she is at least bisexual.

_________________
Dracula loves Sailor Moon


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: LGBT Sailor Moon Fans
PostPosted: Wed Jun 15, 2016 8:27 am 
Aurorae Lunares
Aurorae Lunares
User avatar
Years of membershipYears of membership
Joined: Oct 31, 2015
Posts: 1816
Mamoru definitely seems open to being in a relationship with a man. He doesn't reject Fiore in the R movie because he's a man but because he's already with Usagi. Ami at least seems think Mamoru is "popular with men." I also think Chibiusa is bi and Hotaru might be gay in the manga and Crystal.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: LGBT Sailor Moon Fans
PostPosted: Wed Jun 15, 2016 5:58 pm 
Columnae Creationis
Columnae Creationis
User avatar
Years of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membershipYears of membership
Joined: May 07, 2009
Posts: 37677
Gender: Male
Neon Genesis wrote:
I also think Chibiusa is bi and Hotaru might be gay in the manga and Crystal.

And Hotaru could be bi in the 90s anime, too. :)

_________________
 
Image

Avatar courtesy of ayaka502 (enhanced by Senji-kun)
My J-pop corner


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 53 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2

All times are UTC


Who is online

Moonies browsing this forum: No registered moonies and 8 guests



Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB

contact forum administrator