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 Post subject: Ghost in the Shell live-action...can it actually be good?
PostPosted: Sat Apr 23, 2016 1:22 pm 
Lumen Cinereum
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When I heard Hollywood was going to adapt "Ghost in the Shell", the anime masterpiece, into a live-action movie, I was skeptical to say the least. Hollywood, after all, does not have a good track record in adapting anime into live-action, to put it mildly.

Still, I was not entirely dismissive of it. Paramount and Dreamworks, the studio funding the movie, also successfully adapted a Japanese horror classic, Ringu, into the highly successful "Ring", which was well received by critics and audience alike. And it looks like they are going to give a decent budget for Ghost. Now there is the controversy over Scarlett Johansson's role as the protagonist, Motoko Kusanagi, as another example of white-washing. Here's a just released publicity photo of her in the movie:

https://www.yahoo.com/style/major-contr ... 48283.html

Portrayal of Asians (or lack thereof) on screen has long been an issue in Hollywood. I don't want to minimize that kind of unacceptable discrimination:
http://www.theverge.com/2016/4/18/11455 ... od-casting

But that may not matter as much in the long run if the movie itself is good. So, can Ghost in the Shell Live Action actually be a good movie?


Last edited by Animefan on Sat Apr 23, 2016 5:14 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Ghost in the Shell live-action...can it actually be good?
PostPosted: Sat Apr 23, 2016 4:49 pm 
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We'll see, & this' the only answer I can come up w/ at this stage. :)

I do wish Kikuchi Rinko would take the role, tho, tho Johansson is also an actress I've always liked.

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 Post subject: Re: Ghost in the Shell live-action...can it actually be good?
PostPosted: Sat Apr 23, 2016 5:25 pm 
Lumen Cinereum
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Rika-Chicchi wrote:
We'll see, & this' the only answer I can come up w/ at this stage. :)

I do wish Kikuchi Rinko would take the role, tho, tho Johansson is also an actress I've always liked.


That's the white-washing part I guess. The project would probably be grounded if it was Rinko starring as the lead. That is the Hollywood mentality. The director of the live-action adaptation also does not inspire confidence. Rupert Sander's only previous major film directing job was "Snow White and the Huntsman". That was a decidedly mediocre film known more for Sanders' affair with Kristen Stewart than the artistic merit of the film itself. I could have think of a dozen better directing choices than Sanders.

Still, to be honest, I hope the film does well despite my misgivings. If there is to be a live action version of Ghost, I would like to see it be good. There have been too many horrid adaptations of past anime already.


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 Post subject: Re: Ghost in the Shell live-action...can it actually be good?
PostPosted: Sat Apr 23, 2016 5:51 pm 
Aurorae Lunares
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Actually I thin it can be a good movie. Holy wood can make good movies,and remakes.Sure they were bad ones,but they are still good ones.With a good foundation I think Holly wood could pull it off. As for the cast,honestly I don't know why people are surpries. This is American live action movie obviously it ll take place in America.


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 Post subject: Re: Ghost in the Shell live-action...can it actually be good?
PostPosted: Sat Apr 23, 2016 6:13 pm 
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imaginationgirl wrote:
As for the cast,honestly I don't know why people are surpries. This is American live action movie obviously it ll take place in America.

I think it'd look better if they'd change the lead's name, or at least her given name (her Japanese surname could then be easily explained away by her having Japanese blood), into an English one. :)

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 Post subject: Re: Ghost in the Shell live-action...can it actually be good?
PostPosted: Sat Apr 23, 2016 7:15 pm 
Aurorae Lunares
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But Rikia her body 100 percent fake,she s a robot. She has no blood or dna in here . But a japanese name sounds like a good idea .


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 Post subject: Re: Ghost in the Shell live-action...can it actually be good?
PostPosted: Sat Apr 23, 2016 9:15 pm 
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imaginationgirl wrote:
But Rikia her body 100 percent fake,she s a robot. She has no blood or dna in here . But a japanese name sounds like a good idea .

I knew that (I've read the manga & watched the anime) - theoretically she could be played by a black actress but still retaining her 100% Japanese identity, too :wink: (or for joke's sake, she could even be played by a man lol ). What I meant in my last post above is just that "it'd look better," or sound/feel better, if her name were a Western one, since she's played by a Westerner. And by "Japanese blood," I wasn't talking about her (current) physical body (except for the remaining part of her original biological brain). :wink:

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 Post subject: Re: Ghost in the Shell live-action...can it actually be good?
PostPosted: Sat Apr 23, 2016 9:54 pm 
Aurorae Lunares
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Even putting aside the controversy over her casting, that revealed image doesn't give me much hope for it. It looks like really cheap cosplay to me and I've actually seen cosplay of the Major that looks a lot better than that. It just looks like they dyed her hair black and put her in an Army suit they bought from a costume store and called her the Major.


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 Post subject: Re: Ghost in the Shell live-action...can it actually be good?
PostPosted: Sat Apr 23, 2016 11:04 pm 
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I have no hope for it. It'll be another Dragon Ball tbh. Probably.

I don't like the casting at all. Don't get me wrong, I like the actress but....c'mon..

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 Post subject: Re: Ghost in the Shell live-action...can it actually be good?
PostPosted: Sun Apr 24, 2016 2:27 am 
Lumen Cinereum
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Neon Genesis wrote:
Even putting aside the controversy over her casting, that revealed image doesn't give me much hope for it. It looks like really cheap cosplay to me and I've actually seen cosplay of the Major that looks a lot better than that. It just looks like they dyed her hair black and put her in an Army suit they bought from a costume store and called her the Major.


You could well be right. BUT, if the initial reaction to Crystal offered any lesson, its best to hold off our judgement for the moment until we see more photos. Not always that easy to judge based on one photo. Just sayin'...;)


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 Post subject: Re: Ghost in the Shell live-action...can it actually be good?
PostPosted: Mon Apr 25, 2016 6:30 am 
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JiRam EunSe wrote:
I have no hope for it. It'll be another Dragon Ball tbh. Probably.

I don't like the casting at all. Don't get me wrong, I like the actress but....c'mon..


me in a nutshell I love Miss Johansson as an actress but casting her in this movie was total whitewash it reminds me of the terrible Black Face actors back in the day aka white guys who painted their face black and colored their lips Red

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 Post subject: Re: Ghost in the Shell live-action...can it actually be good?
PostPosted: Mon Apr 25, 2016 10:16 am 
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Based on every other single anime adaptation Hollywood has done, I'm guessing it won't be good. :-P


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 Post subject: Re: Ghost in the Shell live-action...can it actually be good?
PostPosted: Thu Mar 02, 2017 9:19 pm 
Aurorae Lunares
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Well the second trailer came out .https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sEDctELIm3I[youtube][/youtube]


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 Post subject: Re: Ghost in the Shell live-action...can it actually be good?
PostPosted: Thu Mar 02, 2017 9:45 pm 
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imaginationgirl wrote:
Well the second trailer came out .https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sEDctELIm3I[youtube][/youtube]

Visually speaking, not bad, & cool to see Kitano there too. :cool:

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 Post subject: Re: Ghost in the Shell live-action...can it actually be good?
PostPosted: Fri Mar 03, 2017 1:10 am 
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That "nude" costume without nipples and anatomy looks somewhat silly. It would be better to use something like the bandage costume from the 5th Element if they wanted to censor nudity.

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 Post subject: Re: Ghost in the Shell live-action...can it actually be good?
PostPosted: Fri Mar 03, 2017 6:28 am 
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Maraviollantes wrote:
That "nude" costume without nipples and anatomy looks somewhat silly. It would be better to use something like the bandage costume from the 5th Element if they wanted to censor nudity.


I agree Mara I think all due respect to Miss Johansson I think I'll pass on this movie

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 Post subject: Re: Ghost in the Shell live-action...can it actually be good?
PostPosted: Fri Mar 03, 2017 7:05 am 
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I won't be supporting it nor do I have high hopes for it. I am definitely against them white washing Motoko Kusanagi with Scarlett Johansson. Heck pretty much the entire cast is white yet they all have Japanese names which is yellow face.

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 Post subject: Re: Ghost in the Shell live-action...can it actually be good?
PostPosted: Fri Mar 03, 2017 10:18 am 
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I'm hoping it flops unless its just as fun and dumb like the Resident Evil films.

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 Post subject: Re: Ghost in the Shell live-action...can it actually be good?
PostPosted: Fri Mar 03, 2017 12:44 pm 
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MariaTenebre wrote:
I won't be supporting it nor do I have high hopes for it. I am definitely against them white washing Motoko Kusanagi with Scarlett Johansson. Heck pretty much the entire cast is white yet they all have Japanese names which is yellow face.

Actually no this is not yellow face. Yellow face is when you're mocking a culture . Playing Japanese characters is not yellow face Also the Japanese creators are okay with this . ( This is also a America version).

As for the nudity. I kinda see why they did that . In the original the nudity was unnecessary.It make more sense she doesn't have any features .


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 Post subject: Re: Ghost in the Shell live-action...can it actually be good?
PostPosted: Fri Mar 03, 2017 7:09 pm 
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Maraviollantes wrote:
That "nude" costume without nipples and anatomy looks somewhat silly. It would be better to use something like the bandage costume from the 5th Element if they wanted to censor nudity.

Well, that costume is featured in the original manga (I think it's a personal obsessive interest of the manga writer lol ), & the movie is pretty faithful on that regard. lol

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 Post subject: Re: Ghost in the Shell live-action...can it actually be good?
PostPosted: Sun Mar 05, 2017 4:28 am 
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imaginationgirl wrote:
MariaTenebre wrote:
I won't be supporting it nor do I have high hopes for it. I am definitely against them white washing Motoko Kusanagi with Scarlett Johansson. Heck pretty much the entire cast is white yet they all have Japanese names which is yellow face.

Actually no this is not yellow face. Yellow face is when you're mocking a culture . Playing Japanese characters is not yellow face Also the Japanese creators are okay with this . ( This is also a America version).

As for the nudity. I kinda see why they did that . In the original the nudity was unnecessary.It make more sense she doesn't have any features .

You don't have to mock Japanese culture. Playing someone you are not the same race as in this case a White Woman playing a clearly Asian character is yellow face. The setting is very Asian and yet all of the cast is White. This is about as silly as when John Wayne played Genghis Khan. They should have gotten an Asian actress and there are many talented Asian American actresses who could do the job.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Examples_of_yellowface

Also it doesn't matter if the creators are ok with this. This decision was stupid and in my opinion an example of white washing, yellow face and racism.

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 Post subject: Re: Ghost in the Shell live-action...can it actually be good?
PostPosted: Sun Mar 05, 2017 4:59 am 
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MariaTenebre wrote:
You don't have to mock Japanese culture. Playing someone you are not the same race as in this case a White Woman playing a clearly Asian character is yellow face. The setting is very Asian and yet all of the cast is White. This is about as silly as when John Wayne played Genghis Khan. They should have gotten an Asian actress and there are many talented Asian American actresses who could do the job.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Examples_of_yellowface

Also it doesn't matter if the creators are ok with this. This decision was stupid and in my opinion an example of white washing, yellow face and racism.


I agree completely and Hollywood does it all the time I mean look at the shitty live action Dragonball movie or The Last Airbender both were white washed (granted Chi-Chi, Gohan and Master Roshi were Asian and I loved the guy who played Grandpa Gohan he was awesome but still) they even got In trouble with the Live Action Mulan movie as their were gonna write off Li Shang as Mulans love interest and replace him with an Englishman

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 Post subject: Re: Ghost in the Shell live-action...can it actually be good?
PostPosted: Sun Mar 05, 2017 10:40 am 
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MariaTenebre wrote:
You don't have to mock Japanese culture. Playing someone you are not the same race as in this case a White Woman playing a clearly Asian character is yellow face. The setting is very Asian and yet all of the cast is White.

Also it doesn't matter if the creators are ok with this. This decision was stupid and in my opinion an example of white washing, yellow face and racism.

Your definition of "racism" is rather whimsical, at the very least. If a movie is set in Asia then Asians should get the roles? How is that different from "it's Japan here, so only ethnic Japanese are allowed to get the jobs", and other racist propaganda like that? Actually, playing "someone you are not the same race" is something directly opposite to racism. Racism is arguing that only a representative of some particular race should be allowed to get some privileges (role in a movie, job, etc.) - and that's exactly what you argue for. :ninja:

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 Post subject: Re: Ghost in the Shell live-action...can it actually be good?
PostPosted: Sun Mar 05, 2017 2:49 pm 
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Maraviollantes wrote:
MariaTenebre wrote:
You don't have to mock Japanese culture. Playing someone you are not the same race as in this case a White Woman playing a clearly Asian character is yellow face. The setting is very Asian and yet all of the cast is White.

Also it doesn't matter if the creators are ok with this. This decision was stupid and in my opinion an example of white washing, yellow face and racism.

Your definition of "racism" is rather whimsical, at the very least. If a movie is set in Asia then Asians should get the roles? How is that different from "it's Japan here, so only ethnic Japanese are allowed to get the jobs", and other racist propaganda like that? Actually, playing "someone you are not the same race" is something directly opposite to racism. Racism is arguing that only a representative of some particular race should be allowed to get some privileges (role in a movie, job, etc.) - and that's exactly what you argue for. :ninja:


This. You're coming off as a weeaboo when you think white actors can't play Asian characters. It's how the story is portrayed. Hell, people vented of a white female playing The Ancient One in Doctor Strange, but this has a 95% approval rating on Rotten Tomatoes.

Stop complaining about white actors and see if the film flops due to the story. But this one is pretty faithful to the manga.

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 Post subject: Re: Ghost in the Shell live-action...can it actually be good?
PostPosted: Sun Mar 05, 2017 3:26 pm 
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MariaTenebre wrote:
imaginationgirl wrote:
MariaTenebre wrote:
I won't be supporting it nor do I have high hopes for it. I am definitely against them white washing Motoko Kusanagi with Scarlett Johansson. Heck pretty much the entire cast is white yet they all have Japanese names which is yellow face.

Actually no this is not yellow face. Yellow face is when you're mocking a culture . Playing Japanese characters is not yellow face Also the Japanese creators are okay with this . ( This is also a America version).

As for the nudity. I kinda see why they did that . In the original the nudity was unnecessary.It make more sense she doesn't have any features .

You don't have to mock Japanese culture. Playing someone you are not the same race as in this case a White Woman playing a clearly Asian character is yellow face. The setting is very Asian and yet all of the cast is White. This is about as silly as when John Wayne played Genghis Khan. They should have gotten an Asian actress and there are many talented Asian American actresses who could do the job.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Examples_of_yellowface

Also it doesn't matter if the creators are ok with this. This decision was stupid and in my opinion an example of white washing, yellow face and racism.
Well
(Yellowface is a form of theatrical makeup used by white performers to represent an East Asian person. It is similar to the practice of blackface used to represent black performers.[1] Yellowface has been historically prevalent throughout Hollywood films, and continues to be used in the present day.[1][2] In the 21st century alone, Grindhouse, Balls of Fury, I Now Pronounce You Chuck and Larry, Crank: High Voltage, and Cloud Atlas all feature yellowface and non-Asian actors as Asian caricatures.[3] Many writers have noted that portrayals of East Asians in the American film industry generally reflect an ethnocentric perception of them rather than realistic and authentic depictions of Asian cultures, customs, and behaviors.[1][2][4])From wikepedia
The definition of caricature
(car·i·ca·ture
ˈkerikəCHər,ˈkerikəˌCHo͝or/
noun
plural noun: caricatures
1.
a picture, description, or imitation of a person or thing in which certain striking characteristics are exaggerated in order to create a comic or grotesque effect.)

The cast is not all white
Scarlett Johansson as The Major
Michael Pitt as Kuze[8]
(Pilou Asbæk as Batou
Chin Han as Togusa
Juliette Binoche as Dr. Ouélet[9]
Takeshi Kitano as Chief Daisuke Aramaki
Lasarus Ratuere as Ishikawa
Yutaka Izumihara as Saito
Tawanda Manyimo as Borma
Danusia Samal as Ladriya
Pete Teo as Tony
Yuta Kazama as Data Host
Rila Fukushima as a geisha
Kaori Momoi
Michael Wincott

Tricky[10]) Also The Major is not asian here .
There is nothing racist about this . This is american version of a japanese franchise . If Japanese creators have no problem with it .Than there is no problum with it . Different countries remakes foreing movies all the time .


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 Post subject: Re: Ghost in the Shell live-action...can it actually be good?
PostPosted: Sun Mar 05, 2017 5:27 pm 
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I think the most ideal choice for playing the lead character is a half-Asian, half-Caucasian actress, since even in the original manga, the character doesn't look particularly like a typical Asian & also possesses Caucasian-like features - whether a suitable one could be cast is another matter, of course. :)

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 Post subject: Re: Ghost in the Shell live-action...can it actually be good?
PostPosted: Sun Mar 05, 2017 5:56 pm 
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Maraviollantes wrote:
MariaTenebre wrote:
You don't have to mock Japanese culture. Playing someone you are not the same race as in this case a White Woman playing a clearly Asian character is yellow face. The setting is very Asian and yet all of the cast is White.

Also it doesn't matter if the creators are ok with this. This decision was stupid and in my opinion an example of white washing, yellow face and racism.

Your definition of "racism" is rather whimsical, at the very least. If a movie is set in Asia then Asians should get the roles? How is that different from "it's Japan here, so only ethnic Japanese are allowed to get the jobs", and other racist propaganda like that? Actually, playing "someone you are not the same race" is something directly opposite to racism. Racism is arguing that only a representative of some particular race should be allowed to get some privileges (role in a movie, job, etc.) - and that's exactly what you argue for. :ninja:

Also the fact that American movies change the characters America regerdesly what country in ?
We are what we are (Original mexican American Remake take place in Ameica)
Let me in originally was let the right one in . The characters in this one was sweden, but in America there American. There names are change to . To me word racist gets misused a lot .


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 Post subject: Re: Ghost in the Shell live-action...can it actually be good?
PostPosted: Sun Mar 05, 2017 6:04 pm 
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^ This post looks like what I actually read when I'm skimming a post. :P

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 Post subject: Re: Ghost in the Shell live-action...can it actually be good?
PostPosted: Sun Mar 05, 2017 11:09 pm 
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Why don't we see what they've done before judging? Sure, Dragon Ball: Evolution was crap except for Piccolo's looks (and we have to thank James Masters for that), the capsule and the theme song Rule, but they may have done a good job for once.

And note that I have indeed watched DBE, so I know what I'm talking about.

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 Post subject: Re: Ghost in the Shell live-action...can it actually be good?
PostPosted: Mon Mar 06, 2017 4:28 am 
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I saw the trailer, and this really doesn't look like Ghost in the Shell beyond some of the tech.

What happened to the original plot? It was a deeply philosophical discussion on what would theoretically separate a human mind from a true AI and where humanity ends and machinery begins and instead we get... a cliche "you were LIIIIIIIED to" rehash of the hero/heroine getting used by the "good" guys who made him/her. We've seen this a million times before in sci-fi movies.

Why is Motoko white? Could they really not be bothered to cast an Asian actress in her role? Is it because Hollywood thinks Americans can only relate to white people? If that's it... that's really, really insulting to people's intelligence and not at all true. It seems like a lot of remakes/adaptations of Asian media get the "white actress/actor replacing the main Asian character" treatment. Don't get me wrong, I don't think it's inherently racist to cast an actor of one race in the role of a character who was another race. However, when it's becoming a pattern in foreign media being retold in America, I can't help but wonder if Hollywood thinks Americans are too stupid to enjoy movies if the main character isn't white.

Where are the tanks? I don't recall seeing any in the trailer. They play a pretty big role in the franchise. Where's the Puppet Master? Are they ditching him along with the entire plot of the manga? Why do almost all the main characters, not just Motoko, look like they're played by white actors? Again, is it THAT hard to find Asian actors for a movie set in JAPAN? Why is the dialogue in the trailer comprised of stilted, cliched scifi one-liners? The holo-dude's voice doesn't sound "mechanical" or whatever he was trying to go for. It sounds like bad acting.

Even the geisha robots really don't look much like the ones in the manga. The anime/manga 'bots were made to look like humans so that, presumably, people would feel comfortable around them and interact with them like humans. These... things... in the trailer are dead-center in uncanny valley and would never be marketable as entertainment robots. Part of what made the geisha-bots eerie in the manga/anime was that they looked human but didn't act human.

This looks to me like it'll be a trainwreck. With pretty special effects. The biggest question though: Since the trailer indicates it probably won't remotely resemble the anime or manga in plot or style, why didn't they just take out what little it had to do with Ghost in the Shell and make something original?

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Last edited by Fokkusu on Mon Mar 06, 2017 5:17 am, edited 1 time in total.

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