Sailor Moon Forum

OK...

So there comes a time when someone who wants to be a man (or woman) of the world must read the bible. Maybe to find life's answers, maybe just to see what it's about, or maybe so they can tell that Evangelist in their life "I read it! Still atheist!"

I have my own reasons, and no matter what yours are, I think we'll all agree it's more fun to read when we discuss it together. Even if our opinions differ, I hope we'll be able to discuss it in a friendly way. <3 (Unlike the last two times!)

I've been enjoying my reading of it, and if you'd like to embark with me, here are some resources.

http://www.kingjamesbibleonline.org/
The King James Bible is the most popular of all English translations, the source of many turns of phrase in the English language, and is very interesting to read.

However, it is also very old, and has been criticized for being biased and inaccurate. If you're in this camp, you may wish to select a different version here, it would be interesting to compare them.
http://www.biblegateway.com/

If you're not religious, wish to test your faith, or otherwise think the bible would be improved by snarky debate, try the skeptics annotated King James Version.
http://skepticsannotatedbible.com/index.htm

In any case, Genesis can be a long read of some pretty dark stuff. If you're a strapping scholar making it through, reward yourself with these hilarious send-ups!
http://www.youtube.com/show?p=-t4GDPnEb ... er=show_av

Now that the resources are set-up, lets establish some ground rules.

Rules

The rules that apply to this thread are the same laid out in the forum guidelines.
Foremost: No disrespecting other users.
No bashing other users for being Christian. Or for being atheist. Or any other religion. We can't tell you to respect another person's lifestyle. But if you have a problem with another user, their religion, or lack thereof, please keep it to yourself, or take it up in PMs. Attempting to convert other people to a religion via this thread most likely falls under disrespect.

No Politics: The last thread was closed due to some homophobic remarks. I don't want to read that kind of insensitivity, and it will likely result in this thread being locked.

Finally, remember we are talking about the bible and it's contents. This is not always 100% congruous with the religious groups based on it, so keep in mind, when we discuss the bible, we are not discussing you. So stay civil when the text is praised or criticized.

Now that that's out of the way, I've just finished Genesis. How about you all start by talking about your history with the bible?

Great! I don't understand why the other thread was closed. I didn't think the arguments were that bad. Anyways, so most of male babies get their penises circumcised when they are born?

Usually only those in America or countries where Abrahamic religions are the majority. There's a huge debate about it.

Can't we just have one Bible thread?

This is getting really redundant.

Yeah... isn't one at a time enough? Besides, these things tend to almost always get cauldroned... is it really a good idea to resurrect them more times than Jesus? (sorry, that joke was begging to be made)

I think the current two Bible threads aren't just about the Biblical contents, but also the personal thinking/feelings of the respective OPs regarding those parts they've just read, so there's a difference. Of course, if the discussions on the two threads have turned out to be pretty much the same in due course, then they can be merged.


We'll see, & I might request those making troubles to not post on the thread, so that the entire thread wouldn't need to be locked/cauldroned.

I didn't notice Boondocks Moon's until after I made this. If people think they should be merged, I'm not against it.

In regards to resurrecting it, well, I didn't think it was fair that this type of thread kept getting ended by the instigation of on person, so I don't feel any shame in that regard, and that's why I put some rules on this one. (However, if it does happen again, I might take the conversation to a different forum)

Well, as long as a certain forum member doesn't derail this thread... I guess it's not so bad after all.

Carry on then.

Not like they can't share the same thread to discuss their thoughts, or anyone else for that matter.

Yeah, let's keep this one on the straight and narrow.

They can post on each other's Bible threads, of course, as it's now, but like what I've said above, at present each thread is centered on its OP's own Bible reading stages & personal thoughts after finishing a part, so as long as this situation continues, the threads should stay separated.

I think the 'satan' is referring to our self conscious, but saying satan isn't real is like saying God is not real.

He is a fallen angel.

Or in Judaism he is a angel that serves their god and tests man.
Or in Islam he is a genie.
Or in Gnoticism where he is a good angel working for the Supreme Goddess Sophia to lead people to Gnosis.

Though really he is a masculinized Lilith.

As for the Bible I have read much of it as well as the Quran and needless to say I wasn't impressed by either book.

Want to hear something even more interesting? Lucifer is not the fallen angel, enemy of God's real name. That's just what we call him. From what I hear, Lucifer was the name of an ancient Babylonian king, and the fallen angel himself has gone by many, many names to mankind. But of course his biggest trick is making people believe he doesn't exist at all. He's up there right now outside the gates of Heaven, accusing us to God. "Look at those idiots down there! They don't even think you're real! I know you're real, I'm looking right at you! Why don't you hate them like you hate me? Kill them, destroy them, don't give them a second chance! You won't give me a second chance!" etc, etc... that's what he's up there doing right now. Eventually God is going to get tired of his complaining and throw his ass down to earth, and that's when you'll see the antichrist. Though unlike people think, he's not going to come down here and talk trash about God. He's going to instead say he IS God, and fool many people into worshiping him.

Having finished Genesis, I found the story of Esau and Jacob troubling. Why didn't Jehovah like Esau? Why was Isaac giving one son mastery over his others?

That could be true - it's impersonating/posing as God &/or the Holy Ghost, & talking like Him in one's mind, tricking them into believing that they're praying to Him & receiving His guidance, when they're in fact communicating to it & letting it, the Beast, living/settling in their mind. That's pretty cunning & effective in its sabotage of God's pet project I'd say.

I've been wondering something about Genesis. A lot of the patriarchs in the story do pretty awful things, and their actions are often described in neutral terms. Are we supposed to think everything that isn't condemned in Genesis is religiously approved of? Or should some things be taken based on common sense? If so, why does Jehovah punish some actions and not others?

There are lots of other stories in mythology that contain stories with questionable morality. I was always expecting the Bible to be more didactic, but so far it hasn't been. But in the cultures of other mythologies, there's more room to disagree with Gods and have doubt that they haven't done the moral thing. Not so with monotheistic religions.

I'm wondering what the rest of you think of this...

I have noticed the same thing, actually.

However, to be totally honest, the way you've put it is just inviting trouble, IMO. The stuff about it being a mythology and morally questionable are probably going to piss some people off.

I kinda agree with what you've written, it's just that we have to remember that there are very devout Christians amongst us.

I'm trying to walk the line of being neither disrespectful nor dishonest. There are many Christians who will agree that there were morally questionable actions among the stories, there are even versions of the bible that labeled the story of Lot and his daughters "The daughters of Lot conceive in Sin" when no judgement of their actions is given in the original text.

And as for mythology, well, there are still some people who believe in Norse Gods, and Greek ones, but people still call it mythology. Maybe I could use a different word, but I'm not sure how much more sensitive I can be before the meaning is lost... I'm open too suggestion.

The god of the Old Testament is one mean, jealous gin joint bastard to quote a character from King of the Hill. In general if he dosen't punish someone for a specific action he generally approves. Plus as we all know he has ordered some nasty stuff to happen himself. Also in the Old Testament he was more hands on if he didn't like something he would always let you know it.


Well as I mentioned if he dosen't punish you he dosen't care. I could give you the example of Moses. Moses ordered the genocide of countless people way before Hitler and like Muhammad of Islam after he did his mass murder he took the young virginal girls to be his sex slaves. Even though he did these evil things Jews, Christians and Muslims still view him as a hero even though he was nothing more then a murdering thug.

Careful now, I don't want this thread locked on the first page.

(I might have to start looking for a bible discussion forum...)

If calling it like it is gets the thread locked then I can't help that everything I have said is true and can be validated by Bible verses. Heck my brother is a Gnostic and even he agrees that Moses was not a good person.

Oh gee, the Hitler comparison again... I think I know what's going to happen next.

Luke 16:8 "The master commended the dishonest manager because he had acted shrewdly. For the people of this world are more shrewd in dealing with their own kind than are the people of the light."

I guess that's true. I have a hell of a time dealing with you guys but you all seem to get along just fine even if there's a disagreement amongst yourselves.

James 1:27 "Religion that God our Father accepts as pure and faultless is this: to look after orphans and widows in their distress and to keep oneself from being polluted by the world."

This is one of those "Christianity in a nutshell" passages. To do good for others, and enjoy doing it, and understand where the power to do that good comes from. The latter is much harder for most to do than the first part.

They killed a lot of animals in God's "offerings"

Cleverly disguised insult... but not cleverly enough! Mwha ha ha!

Well I can say it in clear-cut earthly terms if you like.

"Don't argue with an idiot, they'll bring you down to their level and beat you with experience."

Please, let's all take this advice. RBL's opinions need not be countered.