Then Tsundereshipper you must not have watched the series or watched it with your own biases because while Luna and the Senshi do at first doubt Usagi's competency as a leader and a superhero she actually proves them wrong as the series goes by and they acknowledge she is a good Sailor Senshi AND leader.
Yeah only when the plot mandates it, but that’s all for moot when she’s reset at the beginning of every season, honestly one of the biggest problems of the 90’s anime is it’s lack of a strong continuity, I shouldn’t have to get an episode of SuperS where Usagi is outright throwing a motherf*cking
tantrum like a 2 year old just because Chibi-Usa ate all her pie, that scene in and of itself proves she’s not mature enough for Mamoru and Saori and Kobayashi were spot on.
There’s a difference between a little maturity gap and the gaping wide
chasm that separates 90’s anime Usagi from Mamoru.
And don’t think my criticism is only towards Usagi here, Mamoru has been needlessly matured up to, and no I’m not in fact simply talking about the age up. Why come S do they suddenly have him act like he’s in
graduate school?! He’s only
18-19, he should not be acting like such a sophisticated socialite! Also why does he have so many effing admirers? The manga only gave him 3 alternative ones outside of Usagi but in the 90’s anime it seems like every fricking girl
and guy wants Mamoru!
Rei, Chibi-Usa, En, Esmeraude, Fiore, Mimette, Saori, Fish-Eye, they
all get the hots for Mamoru some time or another and what’s even worse is that this is frequently pointed out to Usagi to make her the butt of the joke and feel like she can never measure up and that she better “try harder” if she wants to be a good enough girlfriend for Mamoru. Why does
she need to measure up? Why can’t Mamoru lower himself down to her level? Why is she
always the one being made to feel not good enough and that Mamoru has tons of better options and that she’s always in danger of losing him?
Since when do we ever see Mamoru ever feeling threatened and jealous over Usagi outside of like that one gag filler episode with the Dentist? No, he just gets to coast on by and Usagi’s the one always feeling threatened and jealous because Mamoru is just too “above it all.”
This is what I mean when I say their relationship is one-sided, Usagi’s the one always doing the reacting in the 90’s anime while Mamoru is stoic as a statue, at least the manga had the good sense to give him a romantic rival and make him feel jealous over Haruka for once, but in the 90’s anime it seems like Usagi’s the one who’s always having to prove herself for him and he doesn’t need to do jack-sh*t!
Between all his many admirers, his wealth, how he owns not one but
two cars, and the fact that the 90’s anime portrayed him as so perfect and sophisticated post R ——y’know what? I’m just gonna come right out and say it. 90’s anime Mamoru is a Gary-Stu, he was made into a fricking Gary Stu and that’s why Usagi has to always be made to feel like he’s just out of reach and to try harder for him while he’s treated as the unobtainable prize who
never needs to prove himself!
If Mamoru was originally created in the image of Naoko’s ideal man, then the business suits of Toei took that image and Frankensteined it together with their own personal view of what an “ideal man” looks like through the lens of their out of touch, middle-aged Japanese male worldview.
I think Mamoru’s characterization and the portrayal of UsaMamo was what Naoko was referring to about the 90’s anime being bit too male-oriented. Forget all the gratuitous fanservice the 90’s anime added, that’s like whatever and hardly worth getting worked up about (unless we’re talking about Chibi-Usa being used for fanservice) no, the
real male-gazey aspect the feminists should be focusing on is how Mamoru as a character and the “Miracle Romance” in general is framed in the 90’s anime.
They should not be glorifying an outright Gary-Stu and putting him on a pedestal while putting down and degrading his girlfriend, Mamoru should have to work just as hard for his relationship with Usagi as she does for him and do the chasing himself once in awhile. A relationship requires teamwork not “me-work.”
I can tell you right now the fact that 90’s anime Mamoru so much as never even gets jealous automatically disproves your point about UsaMamo being similiar to InuKag. InuKag
both got jealous over each other numerous times, meanwhile in the 90’s anime we only see jealousy from Usagi’s side, how one-sided and unequal can you get? And this is an
established couple yet, sad!
Even the “too cool for school” HaruMichi both get jealous of each other in the 90’s anime, even
Demande who’s not even in a relationship with Saphir and who you claim “doesn’t return his feelings at all” gets alluded to being jealous over Petz with the way they did the transitioning here:
(I could only find the dub but the scene is pretty much the same in the original Japanese too, we all know Demande is only acting in shocked anger over the insinuation that “Saphir betrayed him” that Wiseman’s telling him, but the fact they put this scene just after Calaveras admits Petz was always in love Saphir + with the whole “traitor in general angle” feels like it’s supposed to be hidden subtext on the part of Ikuhara that this is how Demande would react if he ever found about Saphir’s relationship with Petz too.)
And before you try to claim that Mamoru’s simply too mature and healthy to show jealousy, well we’ve already established that Saphir’s the more mature one between him and Demande, and he feels jealousy to the point of
despising Sailor Moon, whom he’s never even met!
Which just goes to show that even the more mature one in a relationship is capable of getting jealous if they love their partner or romantic interest enough, guess 90’s anime Mamoru simply doesn’t love Usagi enough to get jealous over her, sad!
And just to give you an idea of the ridiculousness of how unbalanced their relationship is, Usagi gets so childishly jealous and insecure at times she even starts suspecting little old ladies, while Mamoru barely gets jealous at all.
So you have no party that’s completely overreacting and the other that’s remaining stoic as a stone wall and not reacting at all…
Y’know what Mamoru lacks in his relationship with Usagi? Passion.
In fact Usagi's jealousy of Rei dating Mamoru is proof she likes him romantically as well
Don’t kid yourself, she was never really that jealous at all, you’re exaggerating. Maybe she felt a little annoyed at the prospect of Rei dating Mamoru but it didn’t break her up inside.
Also not always many of these couples usually have a mature one and a immature one with both drawing out the inner matureness or immaturity of the opposite party
Difference is 1. Their maturity gap isn’t quite so wide and 2. They came together on their own without the help of a destined fate
Do you mean from Wedding Peach? I actually do ship them as well and that’s actually another example of a couple who’s dynamic is far more similar to InuKag than UsaMamo. What makes them work and UsaMamo not is:
1. They’re the same age and so on the same maturity level
2. Yousuke isn’t a Gary-Stu like Mamoru
3. And perhaps most important of all,
they came together on their own without being destined for each other by outside supernatural forces, how are you not getting that this is the one quality that will forever make UsaMamo a subpar ship to all the rest of the naturally developed ones?
and regardless of how you feel Usagi and Mamoru have the same personality as Sailor Moon and Tuxedo Mask
Have you forgotten that Mamoru didn’t even
know he was Tuxedo Mask for a time in the 90’s anime and that he existed as a completely separate entity? (Similar to the way Saturn exists separately from Hotaru at times in fact) How could they have always had the exact same personality if Tuxedo Mask himself was a separate self-concious from the start?
In fact the Moonlight Knight says his desire is to protect Usagi not just Princess Serenity. Rendering your entire point and bad arguments moot. Mamoru loves Usagi so much that even when he couldn't become Tuxedo Mask his desire to protect Usagi as so powerful it manifested in real life.
How when he barely even
knew Usagi back in Classic? Also it was thanks to Usagi prompting Mamoru to remember their past in the Silver Millennium that made the Moonlight Knight decide to even return to him. If his existence is just because of Usagi and not Princess Serenity why does Mamoru
need his memories of his past life like that in order to become whole?
And the fact remains he still hadn’t considered dating her until he got all his memories back conveniently enough, whereas before he was treating her almost on the same level as En - a creepy, deranged stalker.
but that is because they don't know them and think Usagi is unsuitable for Mamoru but people who know them know they are a good couple and in the end Saori and Kobayashi come around
Then why are all the Inners and even Usagi’s own
daughter constantly mocking and teasing her on how she has to do better or else Mamoru will leave her?
Again Mamoru has stated many times before he loves Usagi for many reasons like the fun she brings into his life and what a kind, compassionate and dedicated woman that she is.
He never said this, please point me to the exact scenes these occur and I’ll give you your credits due. All he’s said when asked to explain why he loves Usagi is “Because she has a lot of dreams” and “It feels wonderful to be with her.”
Also “fun she brings into his life…” Explain then why he acts exasperated and annoyed by Usagi more often than not and is always looking to get away whenever they’re on outings together such as that time in the Aquarium with Fish-Eye?
In fact a parent would give the child more attention to get their grades up
Uhh no they wouldn’t. Have you never been grounded by your parents for failing grades? What Mamoru did with her is basically the equivalent of grounding your kid.
and even the other Sailor Senshi basically state they won't go places with Usagi until they all buckle down and study
They nag her yes (though mostly only Ami, Luna and sometimes Rei) but I’ve never seen the Inners set up some sort of consequence and reward system for studying the way Mamoru did.
Honestly you seem to think that Usagi is a child at best or a retard at worst.
Because that’s how the show treats her in comparison to Mamoru, and yes she’s demonstrated numerous times that she
is a child when compared to Mamoru, sometimes even more-so than Chibi-Usa, which is just plain embarrassing that Toei portrays their relationship that way.
Also Usagi when she does study does actually do good in her grades but she likes to goof off. It is Minako who even when she applies herself still gets bad grades because she is just not scholastically gifted. Usagi can be if she tries but she dosen't because she likes goofing off.
Oh really? Then explain why she’s still writing in Kana and can’t read or write Kanji
even as NQS thousands of years into the future?
I don’t go out my way to make Usagi look like a child, the
show does. And it’s plain as day to see she has absolutely nothing in common with Mamoru, hell she had to have Michiru and Haruka take her out for the day and teach her to play Violin just because she felt the need to impress him, because once again the 90’s anime treats her like a grade-A idiot compared to Mr.Perfect Gary Stu Mamoru who always seems so far out of her reach.
There’s opposites attract sure, but generally the couples that end up best working out have at least some similarities, Usagi and Mamoru have exactly zero, they’re on two completely intellectual planes and have
vastly different temperments.
InuKag work as well as they do because they’re as similiar as they are different, as are Momiji and Kyousuke, Ash and Misty, etc, etc.
Also that is a crock of [BLEEP] Mamoru does show Usagi affection numerous times through out all the seasons when he is her boyfriend. Hell he goes out of his way to be a good boyfriend even when she isn't being the best girlfriend.
Besides the times he’s kissing her I see him relating to her more like a parent than a boyfriend, there is a distinct difference between the way he treats Usagi and Kunzite treats Zoisite for instance.
For example, the episode in SuperS where he takes her shopping and offers to buy her that designer’s newest line, he’s acting all exasperated and embarrassed by her in-store, the shop clerk is getting impatient and clearly cajoling him to get her to leave Y’know like how one would turn to a
parent to control their rowdy kid? I have never seen anyone ever approach someone about getting their partner under control the way that shopkeeper approached Mamoru about Usagi - that’s usually reserved for parents and their unruly children, she probably also mistook Mamoru and Usagi as a father-daughter pair, I know I would if I saw a “couple” acting like that in public.
And the way Mamoru ends up dealing with the situation is totally not boyfriend material, he ends up placating Usagi and giving in by buying her the clothes then later sighs and laments to himself how she’s making him go broke. Typical spoiling father-daughter behavior.
Why does Usagi have to rely on Mamoru to buy her stuff? Why can’t she buy the clothes using her own money? Why does Mamoru act like it’s such a big burden to spend money
on his girlfriend? Even the fond look he gives her after she gleefully thanks him in joy is more akin to that of a father happy he could make his daughter happy rather than a boyfriend relating to his girlfriend like an equal.
You say Kunzite acts more like a parent to Zoisite than Mamoru does Usagi yet he never once behaves like Mamoru did here, if they do look like they have Daddy/Son dynamic than it’s simply that of the sexy, romantic kind I was referring to in my previous posts, not the awkward actually
relating and
treating your partner as your child.
Also such a great relationship… Usagi couldn’t even be bothered to communicate her birthday and Mamoru acted like the oblivious dumbass in that moment.
Also you are wrong about Inuyasha he is actually 150 years old minus the years he is kept on the tree so he is far older then Kagome and quite frankly I don't recall Rumiko Takahashi ever stating that he is 15 years old in demon years.
Wanna bet?
There it is in bright bold letters, straight from the Official Inuyasha Profiles book I own written by Rumiko herself - he’s 15 in human years.
Except again Usagi and Mamoru's chemistry did bring them together. Even though they fought like immature people who who secretly like one another and eventually their love brought them together and they even began to outright flirt with each other without the aid of memories. Hell they had no memories on their side when they became close as Usagi and Mamoru and showed their chemistry in their love and devotion for one another
I admit they did have some chemistry in Classic and during the Makai Tree arc, they were actually interesting then, but completely lost it once they became a couple post-R. After that they turned into a boring father/daughter like pair who just felt like they were going through the motions and completely lost their spark.
Also Mamoru loses his composure to Usagi numerous times in the series not just in Dreamland or in Episode 2. They both toss barbs that rattle the other.
Post examples then? Because those are the only two times I can recall, besides after the Makai Tree arc he loses all his personality anyways and turns into a perfect, calm, cool and collected Gary-Stu.
Also I am mainly referring to post first season and R when Usagi and Mamoru bicker and Mamoru does so to reign her in and in fact sometimes even in the first season when they fight while Mamoru's message is harsh it is good advice.
He never does this with the
intention of giving out good advice though, except for that one episode where Usagi herself specifically asks both Motoki and Mamoru advice regarding Naru and Nephrite’s involvement.
That his bullying happens to also have some good advice mixed in there sometimes is just a coincidence. Far cry from Kagome and Saphir whose harsh words towards their love interests aren’t meant to simply insult but to teach them better because they care about them. Mamoru does not care about Usagi in Classic prior to episode 35, he’s not insulting her to “help her,” but because he’s a creepy asshole and gets his jollies off picking on random middle school girls in the middle of the street. This isn’t some kind of form of “tough love.”
At least Kagome and Saphir knew Inuyasha and Demande already whenever they start lecturing them. Mamoru barely even
knows Usagi at the start of Classic, what even gives him the right to “reign her in?” (and that’s not even his intention to begin with)
And the gif you show proves my point. Saphir is afraid of Demand
How does that scene prove Saphir fears Demande? Quite the opposite in fact, he just demonstrated he’s the only one willing to blow up at him and call him out on his bull-s*ht and you
still think he’s afraid?
Do you have visual comprehension issues? What part of that scene does Saphir look afraid? Is it because the part at the end where he’s trembling and clutching his stomach? He’s doing that out of pain because he was just flung against a hard pillar, not because he’s scared of Demande.
This is being stern this is Demand being cold and stone and reacting to Saphir's insubordination.
No, stern is always being in control and acting like a strict father figure, like the way Mamoru reprimands both Chibi-Usa and Usagi when they get out of control and start fighting in front of Saori and Kobayashi to which they promptly obey and act all embarrassed over like children who know they’re guilty for misbehaving.
Stern is
not losing control to the point where you overreact with physical violence, I agree that it’s abusive but it’s not stern, Demande is still relating and reacting to Saphir at an equal mental level (if anything
Demande is the one being immature and childish here)
You cannot display bouts of immaturity while being stern, it doesn’t work that way. Demande is lashing out like a child in that scene because Saphir offended him and his fragile ego can’t handle the truth, so he lost control and let his temper get the best of him.
And how the hell is it being cold like stone when he loses his temper enough to both clench his fist and react so violently like that?! Do you even know what being “cold as stone” means? It means being completely stoic and not letting anything bother you or get under your skin, it means not reacting at all.
What Demand did to Saphir here is honestly abuse.
It’s abusive yes but honestly Mamoru is emotionally abusive to Usagi during Classic and the Break-Up arc and emotional abuse is just as bad as physical so I think we’re equal here.
If Demande is physically abusive to Saphir, which yes I agree he is, than Mamoru is emotionally abusive towards Usagi and she’s also dating her abuser. (He’s not abusive anymore post Break-Up arc obviously but that still doesn’t change the fact that she’s essentially dating her former bully, and he treated her like complete trash during said Break-Up arc even if it was for a good reason)
Mamoru was never stern with Usagi in fact if anything he was all to eager to give in to her every whim in many cases.
Yeah, the way an exasperated father gives into their daughter, see also the SuperS Designer episode.
Again I would rather a relationship be healthy then "interesting to watch."
KunZoi and HaruMichi are healthy, loving couples and they’re interesting to watch (because they actually
act like they’re both in love) so what’s UsaMamo’s excuse?
Also Demand never returned Saphir's feelings. At best he was just showing affection to him to keep hjm on a leash.
Why would he even need to do that? What purpose would it serve? And how come he never showed affection like that to Esmeraude and blatantly ignored her if he was just doing to keep his subordinates “on a leash?” Why only single Saphir out like that then?
If anything it was more like how Rubeus led Koan along in their relationship
No, because Rubeus was deliberately
manipulating Koan, I doubt Demande is smart enough to intentionally manipulate anyone what with how he so readily puts his trust in Wiseman and
this is his reaction when he learns Wiseman was actually evil all along:
Even after he
killed Saphir right in front of him he still has to be told by Sailor Moon
s-l-o-w-l-y that Wiseman is bad news before he could put two and two together.
Honestly 90’s anime Demande is on the same mental level as Usagi, they both share only one braincell.
Also I know many yaoi ships and even straight ships where the partners or one of the partners is abusive but they have sensual moments. This applies to Demand and Saphir as well.
I thought you just said Demande never returned Saphir’s feelings at all and that hairbrush gesture was just to lead him on?
So you admit he was outright flirting with him during that time?
A cuck is a wretched thing and Demand and Saphir aren't even bound together as a couple but are a failed couple at best.
Better a failed couple then one who is only with each other for all the wrong reasons, at least I can rest assured that Saphir’s feelings for Demande developed naturally.
and also their love isn't even truly destined it is forbidden because they are from the Earth and the Moon it is only destined in that they love each other so much they will always find each other in each lives they can.
It was never stated in the 90’s anime that Earth-Moon relations were forbidden, that’s only manga and PGSM canon.
And even in the manga they’re
still technically destined for each other because of their Sailor Crystals.
Even in PGSM, the version where Destiny plays the
least factor in their relationship, they’re initially drawn together because it’s said the past is determined to repeat which Venus herself is trying to prevent.
Also Saphir reveres Demand by looking up to him in a hero worship way.
Where? Where does it show that Saphir reveres and hero-worships Demande? I literally just explained it to you how that can’t be the case simply from the way he addresses him.
If he hero-worships him then how is he able to blow up on him and call him out like that? He straight up
insults him in that scene (before Demande flings him against the wall) by implying he’s delusional when he tells Demande to get over it and that NQS will never kneel before him no matter how hard he tries.
That’s not hero-worshipping that’s calling someone out for the being the dumbass they are.
Why doesn’t he address Demande by the “sama” honorific like Esmeraude does if he so reveres and hero-worships then?
Esmeraude hero-worships and reveres Demande, not Saphir.
Demand treats Saphir like a subordinate.
Would rather one part of my ship treat the other part like a subordinate then a literal
child!
It’s still less gross than treating your partner like your kid.
At least Demande doesn’t treat Saphir like his literal
son the way Mamoru treats Usagi like his daughter once they become a couple in the 90’s anime.
And for that matter even if KunZoi
do have a Daddy Dom relationship (which I still don’t think they do - it’s more of a general Dom/Sub dynamic) Kunzite doesn’t treat Zoisite like his
literal son either - it’s purely in a playful and sexy way which is how those dynamics are supposed to be.
Also that is not true in the 90s anime Rei is very mature and poised but she also has a very bad temper and will lash out.
Tell me you didn’t pay attention while watching Sailor Moon,
without telling me you weren’t paying attention while watching Sailor Moon.
The entire point of anime Rei’s character is that she
tries to make herself come off as mature and poised but ultimately fails because she’s just as big of a spazz as Usagi and ends up making a fool of herself.
Really the most mature and poised of the Inners in the 90’s anime are Ami and Mako. (And they’re
still not up to the Outers level)
I will also say that Mamoru also has immature traits and unfortunately not very good social skills
Not after R he doesn’t because Toei turned him into a Gary-Stu.
Also parents discipline their child if they just give them whatever they want even if they behave badly they are spoiling them. Showing again Mamoru is behaving like a boyfriend trying to make his girlfriend happy then a parent with a child
No they both spoil and discipline and Mamoru does the same with Usagi. (Such as giving in and buying those designer clothes for her or disciplining her on her studies by setting limits for their dates or even the way he tells both her
and Chibi-Usa to behave in front of Saori and Kobayashi.)
And that is a plothole in the Inuyasha story.
No it’s just playing around with and deconstructing the concept, also have you ever even studied the role of reincarnation in Eastern philosophy? A lot of times they’re not same person and simply share a soul/consciousness in common - which is what’s going on with Kikyo and Kagome.
also while Kikyo is separate from her it is no different then when Mamoru's subconscious separated as The Moonlight Knight
Completely and totally different scenarios, for one Kagome and Kikyo don’t look identical the way the Moonlight Knight and Mamoru do.
. It is also shown that as Kagome grows older she becomes more like Kikyo
Uhh citation needed? No she doesn’t, if anything she’s still her same immature self and is shown to still be sitting Inuyasha in the epilogue chapter. Kikyo never once thought to sit Inuyasha like that, she also doesn’t have a temper and isn’t overly emotional like Kagome, the narrative establishes that they’re two completely different characters.
Also subverting and deconstructing stories is garbage writing
You do realize Sailor Moon is technically a deconstruction of the Magical Girl genre too right? At least the Manga and PGSM, but even the 90’s anime had some deconstructive elements to it back in Classic when all the good guys died and Usagi finally realized that being a Magical Girl with a fairytale life isn’t all it’s cracked up to be and simply wished to go back to living a normal life.
Also how is deconstruction garbage writing? What makes it “garbage” in your eyes? You do realize that if every single strictly wish-fulfillment fantasy was played straight it would get awfully boring awfully fast don’t you?
There’s only so much unrealistic and saccharine writing an audience is able to take and suspend their disbelief over before they get sick of it.
it was implied that Kagome will gain many of these characteristics and even become more like Kikyo and if not then she can't be Kikyo's reincarnation
Actually the manga specifically does kinda make a case for this when Kikyo finally dies for the last time and the part of the soul she took from Kagome
doesn’t return to her. (But then again how could that clay body have Kikyo’s memories and personalities if the soul
wasn’t Kikyo’s to begin with?)
I just chalk this up to Rumiko not being that great of a writer, she’s like Naoko in that way and simply makes things up as she goes along while being prone to retcons and plot-holes. Her speciality is in writing comedy, characters, and relationship dynamics, not so much plot. In fact Inuyasha was the first big plot-based series she ever wrote and all her previous works were mostly episodic comedies.
and the whole thing is as bad a plothole as the Princess Sailor Moon thing from PGSM.
How was this a bad plot-hole? It’s just a different approach to reincarnation like I explained above, not all reincarnation theories follow the template of being the exact same person in every life.
You have pretty bad taste if you can’t recognize that PGSM has objectively the strongest writing in the franchise.
If she were not Kikyo in a different life as the series shows she wouldn't be born with the Jewel and probably wouldn't get with Inuyasha. Again the same things you hate with Usagi and Mamoru's romance apply double to Inuyasha and Kagome's romance.
No the difference is that being Kikyo’s reincarnation simply allowed her to
meet Inuyasha, her attraction to him had nothing to do with the fact that she was previously Kikyo and would’ve developed anyways if Inuyasha was the exact same but born in the Modern Era.
Whereas for Usagi and Mamoru in the 90’s anime they only become a couple
after getting their memories back, I admit they did show potential for attraction in episode 34 during their ride in the elevator but that’s quickly dashed away with how fast they do a total 180 once their past lives are revealed and suddenly Rei has to give up her boyfriend to her best friend without even a word of protest all because of “~MUH DESTINY!~”
Then the Makai Tree Arc further reinforces this when Usagi and Mamoru only fall in love once they get their memories of the other back and before that point Usagi is back to thinking he’s an annoying jerk like in Classic and Mamoru only warms up to Usagi at an acquaintance level
at best.
Whereas with Inuyasha and Kagome we see their relationship develop every step of the way in a gradual process from enemies, to bickering begrudging allies, to friends, to
best friends, and then finally to true love - and this is all done while Kikyo is right there still in the picture so you know destiny didn’t have a lick to do with their attraction other than the fact that it’s what caused them to meet. They fell in love with each other
for each other though, unlike UsaMamo who seem to actively dislike each other and are only looking at the other through the Ghosts of the Pasts.
Or maybe for Usagi it’s simply because he’s Tuxedo Mask and for Mamoru it’s to fill the empty void within his heart, find an identity to latch onto and not be lonely, neither of which are still great reasons to be with someone even if it’s no longer about the past or a destined future.
Good reasons to get together is if you’re actively attracted to someone for either their looks or personality -
for themselves- it shouldn’t be dependent on anything else.
Honestly I bet if Rei ended up being the Moon Princess he would still be with her, and Motoki being Tuxedo Mask would’ve been a dream come true for Usagi (as she fantasies about many times) and she would still be pursuing him.
Their relationship is solely dependent on circumstances, not who they are as people and that’s already fundamentally a bad relationship. (Even not getting
into the maturity difference and how Mamoru emotionally abused Usagi and is distant like a father figure)
Princess Serenity of the Silver Millennium had the same personality as Usagi
I’m sorry but when was this shown? Oh right
it wasn’t, considering we only get two whole episodes showcasing Princess Serenity’s personality. (episodes 35 and 44 respectively)
And in both those episodes she acts like a demure and poised Princess.
Like how when Sailor Saturn appears to Hotaru she is a manifestation of her past life but still very much Hotaru
Except she’s very much not, do you even pay attention while watching or reading Sailor Moon? In fact the Hotaru-Saturn connection is a good example to use here that proves your theory reincarnation wrong as a mature and wise beyond her years Saturn directly interacts with hyperactive, naive little Hotaru in Stars in order to try to awaken her.
Hotaru does
not the act the same when she’s in her Saturn form in either the 90’s anime or the manga. (Though she’s pretty much the only Senshi this applies to)
Again how is it more acceptable for Kagome to treat Inuyasha like a disobedient pet then for Usagi to be less mature then Mamoru.
Except Mamoru
also treats Usagi as a pet as a matter of fact or did you forget about this Drama CD here?
Literally outright states Mamoru’s more of a pet to Usagi than a girlfriend, he even has the audacity to daydream about all of the other Senshi as his lovers but conveniently leaves out Usagi, gee I wonder why? Also yet another example of mocking Usagi and making her feel like she’s not good enough to be Mamoru’s girlfriend.
Real relationship goals right right there!
It was shown numerous times. For one Usagi and Mamoru have stated before that they love each other for who they are not just because of destiny
You repeating something over and over again with what you
wish could’ve happened or your own off-screen headcanon won’t suddenly rewrite the show that it
did happen.
We all watched the same anime, everyone can tell you right now that Usagi and Mamoru never addressed this head-on within the show itself.
Mamoru's subconscious manifesting as the Moonlight Knight was due to a desire to protect Usagi not Princess Serenity
Why when he barely knew her in Classic? Just because she saved him from Beryl?
they are shown developing feelings for one another even before their memories become back
No it doesn’t, they’re slowly becoming
friends but Mamoru still wasn’t into her. (And Usagi for sure only started acting like a lovesick fool for Mamoru once she got her memories back when she couldn’t even stand him a day prior)
Agency is pretty much just a woke word.
Again,
how? How is it woke?
What if anything does it have to do with race, gender, sexuality or even inequality and power imbalances in general?
Wanting characters to feel like they have agency in a story has f*ck all to do with politics.
For one characters in series only have as much agency as what the writer, writes them to have
This is true but most writers at least show their ships having chemistry and being attracted to each other for who they are as people.
Not so for Toei with either UsaMamo or Sen/Shi in Crystal, which is why both come off feeling hollow.
A writer still has to show their work on why these two characters fit together as people, ships based on destiny like UsaMamo and Sen/Shi is pretty much just skipping that incredibly crucial step and are the writers telling us to ship something just because they say so and the plot demands it.
It’s bad writing if you can’t give good, believable, in-universe reasons for why these characters should be together.
and I would argue that Mamoru, Usagi and the Sailor Senshi and villains all have agency in forms of choice.
Definitely not in the Manga they don’t.
90’s anime is a little better but still not great thanks to the predetermined Crystal Tokyo (Also if they had agency Rei wouldn’t have had to so passively give up her boyfriend to Usagi like that and would’ve been allowed to fight for him.)
PGSM is the only version that gives everyone the most agency.
In fact they could have Chibiusa and break up and even rule Crystal Tokyo as joint sovereigns just not as a couple.
Not in this sort of kids aimed franchise they couldn’t. Sailor Moon would have to be re-labeled an entirely different genre if a realistic co-parenting scenario via either casual sex or donor insemination was explored.
Also Zoisite cuddles up to Kunzite in many ways like a child needing comfort and is drapped over him as such. It definitely looks infantilizing in many cases.
When has Zoisite ever clung on to Kunzite or looked as infantile as
this?
and the idea of past lives and a destined couple getting together is not a bad concept and it is very romantic showing that love crosses time and space.
Only if you can show your work first and show them falling in love in
this life based on who they are as people - which even if you wanna argue InuKag are also based on the destined reincarnated lovers trope (Which they aren’t, they’re a direct subversion of it) they at least do a good job of
showing that work, so it would never be in doubt that they’re in love for any other reason then because of the people they are.
After all the Inners in Crystal aren't with the Shitennou anymore even though they were in their former lives.
Yeah only because Crystal unceremoniously and
hilariously killed them off!
In fact I would argue Makoto could get with Asanuma over Nephrite.
I agree with this, I like Mako/Asanuma as a ship in the Manga/Crystal.
It feels ridiculous to even
suggest that she needs to get over Nephrite though considering she didn’t even know him, broke down in unison sobbing with the rest of the Inners hivemind once he got offed, was okay only a few seconds later and has seemingly completely forgotten about him and doesn’t bother to mention him or bring him up ever again.
(God Crystal is
baddd)
)
]
And the only reason Zoisite uses “sama” instead of “Nii-san” like Saphir does is because he and Kunzite are the same age? (Nii-san is only used for guys that are any amount of years older than you in both familial and non-familial situations since it literally means “elder brother.”)
