I rewatched Cosmos today... and it got worse

[tux67]

You mean anime Stars, manga Stars or both? I'd love to read your thoughts if you could expand on that.

Anyway, I've got a theory. Most fans have gotten into the franchise in the late 90s/early 00s with the anime and only moved on to the manga later - and, as Sailor Moon was the gate opener for manga and anime for many of us, I suspect for most fans Sailor Moon was one of the first, if not the first manga they've ever read. Add to the mix the fact that most fans were probably in their early teens and easily impressionable back then, and it all starts to make sense. I know I would have found the manga to be more "mature" and thought that "Naoko so daring and she was not afraid to go all the way" if I had read the manga when I was, I don't know, 12. But it's hard for me to buy it now. And for a long time anime Stars was, for fans in the anglosphere at least, the hyped, "forbidden" season, so maybe people just wanted it to be as great as their expectations.

But what do I know? Apparently discussing what you perceive as problems in the franchise or how the franchise is handled is akin to being bitterly obsessive and hateful...

All versions of Stars.

The manga has the worst pacing issues of all arcs, 456 characters are introduced for all of 2 seconds and immediately killed off, the senshi don't do anything, the plot and lore (if you can call it that) is convoluted and confusing.

The anime started off with a bang with the fantastic Nehelenia arc, but reverted back to being extremely formulaic and became the Starlights show. That being said, I'll take anime Stars over the manga/Cosmos. At least the storyline is simpler and more linear, with a somewhat satisfying climax.

 

[Lady Pen]

You mean anime Stars, manga Stars or both? I'd love to read your thoughts if you could expand on that.

Anyway, I've got a theory. Most fans have gotten into the franchise in the late 90s/early 00s with the anime and only moved on to the manga later - and, as Sailor Moon was the gate opener for manga and anime for many of us, I suspect for most fans Sailor Moon was one of the first, if not the first manga they've ever read. Add to the mix the fact that most fans were probably in their early teens and easily impressionable back then, and it all starts to make sense. I know I would have found the manga to be more "mature" and thought that "Naoko so daring and she was not afraid to go all the way" if I had read the manga when I was, I don't know, 12. But it's hard for me to buy it now. And for a long time anime Stars was, for fans in the anglosphere at least, the hyped, "forbidden" season, so maybe people just wanted it to be as great as their expectations.

But what do I know? Apparently discussing what you perceive as problems in the franchise or how the franchise is handled is akin to being bitterly obsessive and hateful...

Sailor Stars is more popular in those countries where it was aired; Latin America, most countries in Europe for example, where it was aired after the last episode of SuperS without waiting long. So, yeah, your guess fits perfectly the real situation of Sailor Stars in the fandom. Some enjoyed because it was more Sailor Moon until it ended; others were told the season was the Holy Grail of the 90's anime.

A similar case happened with Eternal and Cosmos. People were told they were the best parts of the manga and that those movies would be the best media of the franchise.

 

[kasumigenx]

Sailor Stars is more popular in those countries where it was aired; Latin America, most countries in Europe for example, where it was aired after the last episode of SuperS without waiting long. So, yeah, your guess fits perfectly the real situation of Sailor Stars in the fandom. Some enjoyed because it was more Sailor Moon until it ended; others were told the season was the Holy Grail of the 90's anime.

A similar case happened with Eternal and Cosmos. People were told they were the best parts of the manga and that those movies would be the best media of the franchise.

The Stars arc of the manga made Usagi even more identical to Miaka of FY hahaha.

 

[Lady Pen]

Guys... I need a menstrual pad on my head in my wedding... like Ami-chan..........

Will it be Extra heavy overnight with Flexi Wings?

Also, did somebody realise Usagi and Mamo are getting married in a sort of European country? That church/castle surrounded by towers looks more like a Disney princess castle instead of a japanese location.

 

[Late to the Game]

All versions of Stars.

The manga has the worst pacing issues of all arcs, 456 characters are introduced for all of 2 seconds and immediately killed off, the senshi don't do anything, the plot and lore (if you can call it that) is convoluted and confusing.

The anime started off with a bang with the fantastic Nehelenia arc, but reverted back to being extremely formulaic and became the Starlights show. That being said, I'll take anime Stars over the manga/Cosmos. At least the storyline is simpler and more linear, with a somewhat satisfying climax.

Agreed, even though I don't mind Stars being formulaic as much, simply because the beginning is so fantastic and I like the last few episodes. But yeah, manga Stars/Cosmos feels smaller every time I revisit it.

Guys... I need a menstrual pad on my head in my wedding... like Ami-chan..........

Will it be Extra heavy overnight with Flexi Wings?

Also, did somebody realise Usagi and Mamo are getting married in a sort of European country? That church/castle surrounded by towers looks more like a Disney princess castle instead of a japanese location.

Menstrual pad?! I can't unsee it now, you're mean, @Lady Pen! lol
But the weirdest thing for me about the wedding scene is that there's no one in the church other than the Senshi. It doesn't look like the important day it's supposed to be, does it?

 

[Lady Pen]

Menstrual pad?! I can't unsee it now, you're mean, @Lady Pen! lol
But the weirdest thing for me about the wedding scene is that there's no one in the church other than the Senshi. It doesn't look like the important day it's supposed to be, does it?

Usagi's friends and family were banished to Nemesis for not flattering her or giving in to her whims.

 

[JunoDX]

Guys... I need a menstrual pad on my head in my wedding... like Ami-chan..........

Will it be Extra heavy overnight with Flexi Wings?

Also, did somebody realise Usagi and Mamo are getting married in a sort of European country? That church/castle surrounded by towers looks more like a Disney princess castle instead of a japanese location.

Could be one of those japanese wedding venues that imitate a european town. Actually it‘s a thing in Japan.

I don‘t like all those pairings (Rei/Mina and Ami/Mako). The only couple is Haruka and Michiru.

 

[Rika-Chicchi]

I don‘t like all those pairings (Rei/Mina and Ami/Mako).

PGSM also features such pairings in the wedding scene. lol

 

[yaya_ikuto]

Could be one of those japanese wedding venues that imitate a european town. Actually it‘s a thing in Japan.

I don‘t like all those pairings (Rei/Mina and Ami/Mako). The only couple is Haruka and Michiru.

so it would mean setsuna is paring with hotaru ?
well with all the adventures mamoru and usagi have its a good finale their wedding
when i rewatched crystal till the end yeah eternal and cosmos too
it feel like a good finale o.o
but when i watched the stars arc in the 90s anime, i didnt feel it like a actual ending o.o

 

[Late to the Game]

In a way, I think it's because we've been sort of trained to expect that in the end there will be a wedding and that the battle should always be/feel bigger than all the previous ones. While 90s Stars did have a final battle, it wasn't much longer and didn't look much bigger than the battle in the last few episodes of SuperS, for example, and there was no wedding. Which, to be honest, didn't bother me at all. With Usagi is still a teenager at the end of Stars and her adamant desire to live life as a normal girl as much as possible, it made a lot of sense to me that she'd end the series as an ordinary girl, with her life ahead of her, sharing a kiss with the bloke she loves. I actually find it to be a much more fitting ending than flash-forwarding to a lacklustre wedding scene, but many people miss the traditional "landmarks" of an ending, so to say.

 

[Slowpokeking]

They should have stopped to introduce new "good side" characters after S since we got 10 senshi.

Yeah the pace was super quick but that's how the manga was like. So you can't blame them too much.

 

[Lady Pen]

In a way, I think it's because we've been sort of trained to expect that in the end there will be a wedding and that the battle should always be/feel bigger than all the previous ones. While 90s Stars did have a final battle, it wasn't much longer and didn't look much bigger than the battle in the last few episodes of SuperS, for example, and there was no wedding. Which, to be honest, didn't bother me at all. With Usagi is still a teenager at the end of Stars and her adamant desire to live life as a normal girl as much as possible, it made a lot of sense to me that she'd end the series as an ordinary girl, with her life ahead of her, sharing a kiss with the bloke she loves. I actually find it to be a much more fitting ending than flash-forwarding to a lacklustre wedding scene, but many people miss the traditional "landmarks" of an ending, so to say.

It's Sailor Cosmos. Had Sailor Cosmos appeared in the 90's anime, it would've been the best final ever to some people.

 

[Late to the Game]

They should have stopped to introduce new "good side" characters after S since we got 10 senshi.

Agreed, but it probably has to do with trying to keep the franchise profitable and running. I suppose the Inner Sensi dolls weren't selling so well by 1994 and Uranus and Neptune didn't sell as much as they wished, so they saw ChibiUsa's role in the Dream arc as an opportunity to focus more on her and maybe appeal to a younger demographic. After that didn't work, they probably tried to generate more interest with the Starlights. When that also didn't work, they called it a day and decided to end the series.

It's Sailor Cosmos. Had Sailor Cosmos appeared in the 90's anime, it would've been the best final ever to some people.

I think I'll never understand the fuss regarding Sailor Cosmos, just like I'll never understand the fuss regarding the Asteroid Senshi. None of these characters have a proper personality or proper function. Cosmos is there to give an explanation, the Asteroid Senshi are there to listen, and that's it, yet somehow some people think the 90s anime not including them was a huge letdown. I don't get it.

 

[Slowpokeking]

Agreed, but it probably has to do with trying to keep the franchise profitable and running. I suppose the Inner Sensi dolls weren't selling so well by 1994 and Uranus and Neptune didn't sell as much as they wished, so they saw ChibiUsa's role in the Dream arc as an opportunity to focus more on her and maybe appeal to a younger demographic. After that didn't work, they probably tried to generate more interest with the Starlights. When that also didn't work, they called it a day and decided to end the series.

They could make more upgrade on the senshi, and design new attractive villains.

That was a wrong move, since Sailor Moon was a huge hit due to it got serious fight and main plot unlike many shojo anime at that time. S got flaws but brought it to a new level. Making it more childish and slow progress on the main plot was meh.

Also I think season 3-5 could have more male main villains.

 

[kasumigenx]

Agreed, but it probably has to do with trying to keep the franchise profitable and running. I suppose the Inner Sensi dolls weren't selling so well by 1994 and Uranus and Neptune didn't sell as much as they wished, so they saw ChibiUsa's role in the Dream arc as an opportunity to focus more on her and maybe appeal to a younger demographic. After that didn't work, they probably tried to generate more interest with the Starlights. When that also didn't work, they called it a day and decided to end the series.

The situation that brought the Cousins/Lesbians debacle is a thing in Japan and the parents did not like buying Uranus and Neptune dolls because they are lesbians and Lesbians are normally killed until the 90s and in the 90s and early 2000s friendzoned in manga/anime.

 

[Slowpokeking]

The situation that brought the Cousins/Lesbians debacle is a thing in Japan and the parents did not like buying Uranus and Neptune dolls because they are lesbians and Lesbians are normally killed until the 90s and in the 90s and early 2000s friendzoned in manga/anime.

But aren't Haruka very popular at that time?

Also I like Michiru because she's so pretty, I don't mind she's lesbian or not.

 

[Late to the Game]

They could make more upgrade on the senshi, and design new attractive villains.

That was a wrong move, since Sailor Moon was a huge hit due to it got serious fight and main plot unlike many shojo anime at that time. S got flaws but brought it to a new level. Making it more childish and slow progress on the main plot was meh.

Also I think season 3-5 could have more male main villains.

Well, it was clear by the end of SuperS that it wasn't the best move, but we have the benefit of hindsight. At the moment, maybe they felt sales were going down because things had got too serious. And, given Naoko Takeuchi felt like treading fairy tale territory with the new arc, it might have made sense to the suits, even if they were ultimate proven to be wrong.

But aren't Haruka very popular at that time?

Also I like Michiru because she's so pretty, I don't mind she's lesbian or not.

If we're to believe Tuxedo Unmasked, Michiru wasn't popular at all, and Haruka, while popular, was behind Ami and Minako (and, occasionally, Hotaru) in terms of popularity.
Why Was Ami the Most Popular of the Sailor Soldiers?

How Did the Sailor Moon Cast’s Popularity Differ in the Anime and Manga?

Also, I suppose the characters' popularity didn't necessarily reflect in their toy sales. After all, considering the anime was somewhat popular among boys and teenage boys as well, a considerable part of the public weren't likely to buy merchandise at all.

 

[Talentless Fool]

If we're to believe Tuxedo Unmasked, Michiru wasn't popular at all, and Haruka, while popular, was behind Ami and Minako (and, occasionally, Hotaru) in terms of popularity.

HOW DARE DO YOU SAY THAT?!!?!

Well, that is peculiar.
Well, regardless of her popularity, she was portrayed as the most important of the Outer trio (just like Rei was for the Inners).
In the credits, she is always billed first (again just like Rei) and there are a lot (and I mean a lot) of scenes especially near the end of S and for the whole of Stars where she is placed in the center, hence the main focus, of several scenes.
I noticeably remember during Usagi's and Seiya's parting in the early morning at the amusement park with Michiru's face behind Usagi's as the last scene.

Still, it is kinda shocking she wasn't a popular character, perhaps it's the same syndrome that affected Puu.

 

[Late to the Game]

HOW DARE DO YOU SAY THAT?!!?!

Well, that is peculiar.
Well, regardless of her popularity, she was portrayed as the most important of the Outer trio (just like Rei was for the Inners).
In the credits, she is always billed first (again just like Rei) and there are a lot (and I mean a lot) of scenes especially near the end of S and for the whole of Stars where she is placed in the center, hence the main focus, of several scenes.
I noticeably remember during Usagi's and Seiya's parting in the early morning at the amusement park with Michiru's face behind Usagi's as the last scene.

Still, it is kinda shocking she wasn't a popular character, perhaps it's the same syndrome that affected Puu.

Well, I'm not the one saying it, it's the results from Animage and Nakayoshi popularity polls! Don't hate the messenger! lol

 

[Talentless Fool]

Well, I'm not the one saying it, it's the results from Animage and Nakayoshi popularity polls! Don't hate the messenger! lol

WAT?!

MASAKA DESUWA DAME!!!!

It can't possibly be!

It must be the work of some evil entity at bay!
It must be