Queen Serenity Stars arc

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Jul 6, 2018
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#61
I think I've found another piece of the puzzle...

In Guardian Cosmos's telling of Queen Serenity's visit to the Galaxy Cauldron, her use of the word nukegara (literally exuviae, shell, husk) left me baffled because it seemed like such a weird image. Taking the line literally/at face value, I just couldn't wrap my head around it. This led me to conclude the word should be translated more loosely/figuratively, as newborn or fledgling or something along those lines. Fragment, shell, and husk - the official and MissDream translations - didn't seem right. But now, I actually think MissDream's choice - husk - is correct. (Sort of.)

Today, I picked up a copy of "The Collected Poems of W. B. Yeats: A New Edition, Edited by Richard J. Finneran." This is the book Hotaru is seen reading in the Dream arc. The book opens with a quote from William Blake, whose painting "Satan in his Original Glory" inspired one of Naoko's illustrations of Super Sailor Moon:

“The stars are threshed, and the souls are threshed from their husks.”​

Could Guardian Cosmos's line actually be an allusion to this quote, with which Naoko would certainly have been familiar? In light of this quote, perhaps by "husk of a star," Guardian Cosmos meant that Queen Serenity was holding a soul, or at least the raw material for making a soul. Given the use of "star seed" in this arc to essentially mean "soul," perhaps by analogy the line in question could be translated as "star pod"?

Thoughts?
We have to check if they used nukegara in the Japanese translation of the quote, but I think
you are into something.
 

MementoNepenthe

Systema Solare
Mar 8, 2012
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#62
Apparently the "quote" in question is actually a deliberate misquote on Yeats's part. (The actual Blake quote is "And all the Nations were threshed out, and the stars threshed from their husks.")

Anyway, though Yeats seems to be a pretty popular poet in Japan, after an hour of Googling various things, I've yet to come across a translation of his poetry that included that (mis)quote. I'm sure it would be included in one of the translated anthologies of his work, but I wouldn't know which one and none of them seems to be online for perusing. Maybe someone else will have better luck with Google. Or maybe one of forum members who lives in Japan or is going there in the near future, if they get a chance to visit a bookstore, can keep their eyes peeled for any volumes of Yeats poems and report back if they included the quote in question.

Of course, the book Hotaru reads is in English, so it's probably safe to assume that Naoko actually owned that edition, and perhaps translated the quote herself using an English-Japanese dictionary. Even if there's no official Japanese translation of the quote, it's still possible that Naoko did her own translation (with "husk" translated as "nukegara") and that Guardian Cosmos's line is still an allusion to it.

I'd say someone will just have to ask her about it, but even if they did she probably doesn't remember why she wrote what she did since she's said before that she has no memory of writing so much of the manga.
 
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Tsundereshipper

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Jun 17, 2019
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#63
Not to keep harping on this, but while going through the manga for the 10,000th time for something I'm working on at the moment, I realized that your idea that Queen Serenity was not originally from the moon may have come from what Nehellenia says in the penultimate chapter of the Dream arc:



"Silly you... You too have come from another galaxy. We share the same origin." (Tokyopop)​
"That's funny since you, too, came to this planet after wandering the galaxy. Aren't we both immigrants here?" (MissDream)​

Both translations make it sound like Queen Nehellenia is talking to Queen Serenity alone. Tokyopop has her claim Serenity is from another galaxy and MD has her say Serenity was a bit of a drifter. However, here's what the Japanese text says:

おかしなことを​
おまえたちもまた はるか彼方の銀河から この星へともたらされた者たち​
わたしたちの源は同じではないか​
That's strange.
You, too, were all brought to this star from the other side of the galaxy.
Isn't our birthplace the same?

She uses the word "omaetachi," the familiar (possibly old-fashioned?) plural you. She's saying that Serenity and the Inners are not native to the Moon/Solar System (i.e. that they all came from the Galaxy Cauldron). She also says they were brought to (the Moon), which suggests there was no choice of where they settled, but rather it was their destiny or the result of other forces.
So this was a mistranslation after all and Queen Serenity isn’t in fact, a non-native of the Moon from another galaxy? This was just meant to be metaphorically referring to the fact on how they were all born from the Cauldron? Well there goes my headcanon about how Queen Serenity was a refugee similar to Kakyuu whose planet got decimated by Galaxia, kinda bums me out, I liked connecting Galaxia’s history to Usagi’s in that way, also it would’ve helped explain why the Earth was so suspicious of her reign in the first place if she was a literal alien that just showed up out of the blue one day.

Still this leaves a slight plot-hole, if Queen Serenity was always native to the Moon, and Usagi was never supposed to (or able?) become Sailor Moon in the past then who was the Moon’s Senshi? If Queen Serenity was created to hold the Moon’s Star Seed by the Galaxy Cauldron as per this text, why was she never able to transform? Especially during the fight against Metallia? (Yes I realize this was later retconned in and Star Seeds and the concept of each star having it’s own Senshi wasn’t a thing during the DK arc but shush)

We know Nehellenia is an incarnation of Chaos, but if both her and Queen Serenity are in fact Moon natives, doesn’t this outright confirm that Nehellenia is literally “the dark side of the moon?” What if she was always meant to be the original Sailor Moon and the reason why she resented both Queen and Princess Serenity so much as to curse them was because Queen Serenity, by creating Princess Serenity in the form of a new, healthy Star took that status away from her?

Did she only become an incarnation of Chaos once Princess Serenity was birthed and took away her status so she was now technically a “failed star?” (i.e. Chaos) Or was the Moon a strange beast of a star and was one half healthy (So that it was able to produce the universe’s most powerful Star Seed/Sailor Crystal in the form of Sailor Moon?) and one half “underdeveloped?” (Which is why it housed a Chaos remnant, i.e Nehellenia.)

Is this why the Moon was never able to produce natural life like the Earth and it’s whole biosphere was artificially created?

What their original forms life span during the Silver Millenium is unclear though.
The SilMil people had to be long-lived though, since the manga and musicals say their longevity was one of the reasons the Earth was jealous of them.


I think I've found another piece of the puzzle...

In Guardian Cosmos's telling of Queen Serenity's visit to the Galaxy Cauldron, her use of the word nukegara (literally exuviae, shell, husk) left me baffled because it seemed like such a weird image. Taking the line literally/at face value, I just couldn't wrap my head around it. This led me to conclude the word should be translated more loosely/figuratively, as newborn or fledgling or something along those lines. Fragment, shell, and husk - the official and MissDream translations - didn't seem right. But now, I actually think MissDream's choice - husk - is correct. (Sort of.)

Today, I picked up a copy of "The Collected Poems of W. B. Yeats: A New Edition, Edited by Richard J. Finneran." This is the book Hotaru is seen reading in the Dream arc. The book opens with a quote from William Blake, whose painting "Satan in his Original Glory" inspired one of Naoko's illustrations of Super Sailor Moon:

“The stars are threshed, and the souls are threshed from their husks.”​

Could Guardian Cosmos's line actually be an allusion to this quote, with which Naoko would certainly have been familiar? In light of this quote, perhaps by "husk of a star," Guardian Cosmos meant that Queen Serenity was holding a soul, or at least the raw material for making a soul. Given the use of "star seed" in this arc to essentially mean "soul," perhaps by analogy the line in question could be translated as "star pod"?

Thoughts?
So what does this mean? Does the use of the term nukegara just mean Naoko was trying to allude to Queen Serenity creating a new Star Seed from scratch? Not that it was already fully formed, but broken and Queen Serenity was just taking it to get fixed? Which one is it?

The Silver Crystal had to Evolve into the Silver Moon Crystal for Usagi and into the Pink Moon Crystal for Chibi-usa before it was a Sailor Crystal. Usagi was more or less a fake Senshi up until that point. Sailor Moon wasn't supposed to exist but because she kept wanting to be one to keep fighting the Silver Crystal eventually granted her wish by becoming her Sailor Crystal.
If Sailor Moon was a fake Senshi then who was the Moon’s Senshi? It couldn’t be Queen Serenity since we never see her transform, unless it was a Kakyuu type situation. Remember too that the whole “Sailor Moon wasn’t supposed to exist” part was back when Naoko was only planning to have one arc, so the concept of every star having it’s own Senshi didn’t exist yet. But as it stands now, with the current lore she developed later on, this point no longer makes sense.

it's clear that the Silver Crystal is something of a Moon Family heirloom. It existed before Queen Serenity was ever born, and thus she must be a native of the moon. She did not find the crystal, nor did she found the Silver Millennium. In a sense, you are right that the crystal was never really Queen Serenity's in the first place, but only because she inherited it (presumably from her mother) as Princess Serenity inherited it from her.
The concept of the Silver Crystal being a Moon family heirloom again existed before Naoko thought up the idea of Sailor Crystals and Star Seeds, so this no longer applies within current canon as it’s made quite clear the Silver Crystal is Usagi’s Star Seed/Sailor Crystal, and therefore the Moon’s... Which I suppose could have it serve “heirloom like” status within the Moon, but I don’t think a piece of one’s Sailor Crystal can be broken off from the holder without damaging the Star Seed, so to make it fit within current canon I now headcanon that the Moon Kingdom crafted special gemstones in the likeness of the Silver Crystal and used them in celebration of the Silver Crystal as a sort of “national gem status.”

Do the Sailors really die because their Sailor Crystals are stolen? Or do they die because, well, in the process of having their crystals stolen, they're basically blown to smithereens by Galaxia/the Animamates? It's not like their Sailor Crystals are magicked out of their bodies the way their Pure Heart Crystals or Dream Mirrors were in the anime, so it's a bit hard to tell what the real~ cause of death is.

Keep in mind that the Sailors don't get their Sailor Crystals until the Dream arc, so presumably they've been living until then without them? And Usagi always kept the Silver Crystal as separate from her body, whether in one of her brooches or just on display in the Crystal Palace. (And given that it's the MnG on display in the future and not the SMC, it would seem they are separate, simultaneously-existing crystals. I mean, obviously the SMC didn't exist yet when Naoko wrote the BMC arc, but you know what I mean! :P)
I think Stars makes it pretty clear that Senshi can only truly die if either their Sailor Crystals are broken/smashed into smithereens, or dropped back into the Galaxy Cauldron. (See Tuxedo Mask)

I think just extracting them out of their bodies doesn’t cause them to die but just reduces them into soulless husks. (much like when one’s Heart Crystal or Dream Mirror is extracted in the anime) Of course we do see some Senshi like Usagi able to function perfectly fine with their Crystal out of their body so I wonder if it has to do with proximity and how far away the Crystal gets? Like it’s only okay if it’s super close to the user’s body even if outside?

As for this part: “Keep in mind that the Sailors don't get their Sailor Crystals until the Dream arc, so presumably they've been living until then without them?”

I think Naoko wants us to assume that the Sailor Crystals have always been inherently part of the Senshi, and the Dream arc didn’t so much as give the Senshi their Crystals as it made them aware of them. (See also Mamoru discovering he’s always had his own Sailor Crystal i.e. the Golden Crystal, during the arc. It wasn’t gifted to him by Helios or anything, he just found out it had always been within his body and is the source of his power)

And then there's the whole thing with a fragment of the Silver Crystal breaking off and going into Tuxedo Mask's body... So either the MnG truly is distinct from Usagi's Sailor Crystal, or Sailor Crystals can fragment without any major repercussions?
Considering what Helios implies during Dream, I think this is meant to showcase how the Silver and Golden Crystals were originally one and that’s why they’d be able to be exchanged between Usagi and Mamoru. The concept of Lethe and Mnemosyne being twins also seems to strongly suggest that some Sailor Crystals/Star Seeds got split in two but were originally one whole.


I mean... We kept hearing that if Saturn dropped her scythe, the world would be destroyed. She dropped her scythe and...everything seemed fine? There was some destruction, but no more than always accompanies these ultimate showdowns. So yeah, I think her powers were just overstated.
It’s strongly implied that there was great destruction from Saturn’s Glaive though, after all we see in the manga that the planets within our current Solar System no longer have any life or civilization left on them when we know that at least the Moon and Venus had vibrant populations during the SilMil, which makes me believe this was Saturn’s doing.

Plus, just from the architecture and style Earth seemed to be quite different during the Golden Kingdom era too and they also knew of the Moon Kingdom back then while current day Earth has no clue about how the Moon used to have life(See Himeko in the Princess Kaguya story) no history records of the SilMil until they get to Crystal Tokyo, or even that they have their own Crown Prince, which leads me to believe that history was reset and we’re supposed to make the assumption that in the SM universe, the Dinosaur age up until modern day is a reset of the Earth’s history/development by Saturn’s Glaive drop after the fall of the SilMil.
 
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MementoNepenthe

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Mar 8, 2012
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#64
I think the best fix to the Silver Crystal problem(TM) is to think of the Silver Moon Crystal and the Maboroshi no Ginzuishou as separate crystals that merged together at some point (probably during the Dream arc).
 
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Sep 13, 2009
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#67
Okay, just spit-balling ideas for the moment. Suppose that the reason we never saw Queen Serenity transform isn't because she never could, but because she couldn't anymore. Recall that Neo Queen Serenity was formerly Sailor Moon, and that she could no longer transform after becoming queen, as though becoming queen (or king, in Mamoru/Tuxedo Mask/Endymion's case) was some form of retirement for a Sailor Senshi. Likewise, Queen Serenity was already queen by the time we first see her, so she would have already been retired from being the Moon's Sailor Senshi by that point.

Regarding the Silver Crystal being an heirloom of Moon royalty vs. just Usagi's star seed/Sailor Crystal, it is strongly implied that the Silver Crystal Usagi has is the same one that had belonged to Queen Serenity, with Usagi having inherited from her following the fall of the Moon Kingdom and Usagi's reincarnation on 20th Century Earth. But then, when we get the whole thing with Sailor Crystals and star seeds later, that calls into question both the uniqueness of the Silver Crystal and how it could have passed from Queen Serenity to Usagi if it was supposed to have always been tied to one or the other like a star seed is supposed to.

Well, recall that Queen Serenity didn't reincarnate on Earth with those who did, and, as has been mentioned above, Princess Serenity didn't seem to have her own crystal at the time that her mother owned the Silver Crystal, hence why she inherits it when reborn on Earth as Usagi. Most assume that Usagi's inheriting the Silver Crystal is why the queen wasn't reborn too; that she sacrificed her rebirth for that of her daughter's by passing on her crystal to Usagi. But then, that comes back to the question of why Princess Serenity didn't have her own crystal. Simply put, because she didn't need one at the time. The Moon Kingdom was at peace, the queen had the most powerful crystal at her disposal, and the princess had four guardian Sailor Senshi to protect herself. She didn't need a crystal of her own at the time.

But, that isn't necessarily to say that she didn't actually have a crystal of her own. Like what's been said above, the Dream arc had the Senshi acquire their Sailor Crystals not simply by being physically given them, but becoming aware of them, having their presence made manifest before them. Likewise, Princess Serenity may have always had a Sailor Crystal of her own within her, but because she was still just a princess and never fully awakened or trained as a Sailor Senshi (never needing to due to the aforementioned peace and protection she had), her crystal never manifested to hers or anyone's awareness. In other words, her star seed never showed itself to be a Sailor Crystal.

It is possible that Queen Serenity was also not aware of the possibility of her daughter having her own crystal either, since it never manifested itself, and thus she passed on her own Silver Crystal to her daughter, sacrificing her own chance at rebirth for her daughter. And because the princess's crystal never manifested itself, the queen's Silver Crystal must have kinda overrode or maybe even merged with the princess's/Usagi's star seed, making what was once her mother's now her own. Its later evolution into the Silver Moon Crystal was then the final step in making it fully Usagi's and no longer her mother's.

In addition to all of that, Chibiusa also had a Silver Crystal of her own that manifested itself from within her during the final battle with Death Phantom/Nemesis, awakening herself as a Sailor Senshi. It is a separate crystal from that of Usagi/Sailor Moon/Neo Queen Serenity, but is still called the "Silver Crystal" just like her mother's. This separate second Silver Crystal later evolves into the Pink Moon Crystal, making it fully Chibiusa's and no longer resembling the one that belonged to her mother. This then suggests that the Silver Crystal is an heirloom in a more metaphorical sense than the original literal meaning, as if to say every princess of the Moon's royal family is born with a star seed that will manifest itself as a Silver Crystal upon each princess's awakening as a Sailor Senshi, and which may later evolve into a new form that is unique to each Sailor Senshi Moon Princess.

And when each princess assumes the throne and becomes queen, they essentially retire from being a Sailor Senshi and can no longer transform, but still possess the fighting power of their crystal, which by this point may in turn revert back to its original "Silver Crystal" form during the queen's reign. But in the unique case of Princess Serenity, she never became a Moon Senshi so her crystal never awakened within her, so her mother passed on her own at the cost of her life and rebirth, not knowing the dormant potential of her daughter's own star seed and instead giving her own for Usagi to use as Sailor Moon, since it was already so powerful and Usagi would need to defend herself sooner than later against an enemy so powerful that the queen could only seal away rather than destroy outright.

Otherwise, had Princess Serenity awakened as a Sailor Senshi back in the Moon Kingdom, she may indeed have manifested of her own Silver Crystal from her star seed instead of never doing so and being given her mother's in her reincarnated life.
 
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SM458

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Nov 16, 2014
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#69
There a lot of mystery in that act that need some clarifying answers from Naoko.

I interpreted as when fall of Silver Millennium, their bodies (Queen Serenity and Princess Serenity) were transported to the Galaxy Cauldron. That when Queen Serenity asked Guardian Comsos for a new life for her Daughter while she remain to not to be for exchange for everyone that lost their life on the fallen Moon Kingdom to also have a new life with Princess Serenity.
 

Akari @ria

Luna Crescens
Jun 17, 2017
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#70
I put everything under spoilers, so for those who hasn't read the manga, the ending isn't revealed.

Spoiler: show

in act 54 (stars 5) of the italian shinsouban the sailor starlights talk about how everything is born saying: "all the stars are born and grow from a seed, the star seed.
But not only the stars, all the various living beings of any shape or size, despite being so different from each other, all are born from a star seed.
... the sailor crystals, born as special star seeds, have been sent to their various chosen planets.
They later grew up with those stars and eventually became guardian warriors tasked with protecting their own planets."

I cut a small part of the dialogue where they said that even the earth and its inhabitants all have a star seed, as well as the sailor senshi.

so, summing up ... each star seed is born from cauldron, the planets and stars are born from special star seeds called sailor crystal, when the sailor crystal arrives on the star or planet grows together with it, and, from the sailor crystal manifested in human form, a sailor senshi born.

I have a theory about this:

Since every living creature has its own star seed, this means that queen serenity already had a crystal of her own which wasn't the ginzuishou.

the moon was already there, because queen serenity was already present and adult when she gave birth to the princess.

Later guardian cosmos said that, when neo princess serenity was brought inside cauldron, queen serenity was a shining star that came to the cauldron in the form of a complete star.
In her chest she held the remains of a small star with a strenght and a light like the one of sailor moon, in fact i think she was holding neo princess serenity when was phisically dead after the attack perpetrated to silver millennium from dark kingdom in the past.

Could it be that queen serenity wanted to give a second chance to the princess gifting her with more power that the ginzuishou alone couldn't have given her?

Queen serenity allowed herself to be dispersed in the sea of cauldron, but, speaking with guardian cosmos, she guaranteed her daughter new life and enormous power, that would allow her to defeat the enemy rather than just seal it.

The life of a mother who protected her daughter, that she understood she can become a precious existence, that she could change everyone's fate if only was given her a chance.

A few pages before, sailor cosmos says that the manifested power that brings back the sailor crystals who have regained their original form to their stars after being reborn from cauldron does not come from the silver moon crystal, but is the power that came from the union of the sailor crystals of the whole galaxy.

That power is called the final lambda power and is the power of the cosmos crystal (meaning that the power of all the sailor crystals in the galaxy manifested itself by collecting into a single place, eternal Sailormoon body in this case, and because of that the cosmos crystal appear, perhaps by modifying her own crystal in shape and power).

A crystal that has returned to its basic form (ginzuishou) when they went in the 30th century.

In fact, Chibiusa used ginzuishou until she unlocked her pink moon crystal.

Sailor cosmos, as revealed by Ceres and the others, is the final form of the future sailor moon.

So, in the distant future, when sailor chaos arrives, neo queen serenity unlocks part of her memories of the past, remembering that power she have used inside cauldron and realize that she's the owner of the cosmos crystal and then she unlock it and she transform into sailor cosmos for fight.

Furthermore, I have always thought that the eyes of sailor cosmos are of a different color from those of Usagi / Sailormoon because they reflect the entire universe and the stars (to be clear, i think they are starry like those of the mugen silhouette in heartcatch pretty cure).



Do the Sailors really die because their Sailor Crystals are stolen? Or do they die because, well, in the process of having their crystals stolen, they're basically blown to smithereens by Galaxia/the Animamates? It's not like their Sailor Crystals are magicked out of their bodies the way their Pure Heart Crystals or Dream Mirrors were in the anime, so it's a bit hard to tell what the real~ cause of death is.
Spoiler: show

in the manga it is specified that, when galaxia and the animamates attacked, for the sailor senshi killed was only their human death ( the death of their physical body, because their true essence is the sailor crystal which is indestructible, in fact their bodies are turned to dust in an instant because of galaxia power manifestation).


I think Stars makes it pretty clear that Senshi can only truly die if either their Sailor Crystals are broken/smashed into smithereens, or dropped back into the Galaxy Cauldron. (See Tuxedo Mask)
Spoiler: show

the sailor crystals are indestructible.
Sailor cosmos said that the sailor crystals thrown into the cauldron were only scattered in it, in fact it is implied that in order to reborn they must pass through guardian cosmos and wish to live again with a phisical body.
Perhaps Galaxia claimed that the sailor crystals had dissolved because chaos was fused with cauldron and had incorporated them into her body.
 
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MariaTenebre

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Jul 22, 2009
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#71
Well I would argue that with regards to the Silver Crystal that yes I do think it was Queen Serenity's Sailor Crystal and that she was most likely a Sailor Moon at one point. I also think that all members of the Moon Matriarchy have the power to make manifest the Silver Crystal. That being said they can only do so usually when the previous person has sort of past down their Sailor Senshi power to them. Which is why Queen Serenity couldn't transform into Sailor Moon during her time as Queen of the Silver Millennium that we saw and why Neo Queen Serenity couldn't transform into Sailor Moon anymore and with Chibiusa as the new Sailor Moon. I believe Tsundereshipper also theorized that Sailor Chibi Moon wasn't the Sailor Senshi of Our Moon like her mother was but some Pink Moon. That is clearly nonsense as for one Chibiusa is said to be the next generation Sailor Moon and if she is not the Sailor Senshi of our Moon then during Crystal Tokyo there wouldn't be a Senshi of our Moon anymore as Neo Queen Serenity can't transform anymore.

Once more Usagi herself after she is Neo Queen Serenity will most likely become Sailor Cosmos so I suppose since she is no longer Sailor Moon The Cosmos Crystal will Merge with her own

However it is interesting with Akari@ria that I heard that interpretation as well. That the scene we saw in the manga didn't happen prior to Princess Serenity's birth nor was Queen Serenity going to the Cauldron the Impetus for her birth but happened after the fall of the Silver Millennium and Queen Serenity went to I guess throw herself into the Cauldron and allow her Crystal to fully merge with her Daughters to give this "shell of a star" new life. I don't know which interpretation is more accurate IE that Queen Serenity came to the Cauldron before hand and due to the Power of the Cauldron conceived and bore Princess Serenity or she came after her daughter was born and after the fall of the Silver Millennium to throw herself into the Cauldron to give her Daughter new life. It would be interesting of the latter was true because unlike the 90s anime I don't believe we ever saw how Queen Serenity died. She obviously did so as I believe her spirit was in the Moon Computer but how she did so was not shown to my knowledge nor was it shown the reason why she died.
 
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#72
Spoiler: show

the sailor crystals are indestructible.
Sailor cosmos said that the sailor crystals thrown into the cauldron were only scattered in it, in fact it is implied that in order to reborn they must pass through guardian cosmos and wish to live again with a phisical body.
Perhaps Galaxia claimed that the sailor crystals had dissolved because chaos was fused with cauldron and had incorporated them into her body.
Galaxia has her bracelets so that her Sailor Crystal could be outside her body and have the Sailor Crystals stick together I guess.
 
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Tsundereshipper

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#73
I think the best fix to the Silver Crystal problem(TM) is to think of the Silver Moon Crystal and the Maboroshi no Ginzuishou as separate crystals that merged together at some point (probably during the Dream arc).
So does that mean the Maboroshi no Ginzuisho was Queen Serenity's Sailor Crystal, and when it was passed down to Usagi it evolved into her own Sailor Crystal which is the Silver Moon Crystal? (Much in the same way Chibi-Usa's Crystal became the Pink Moon Crystal?)

Well I would argue that with regards to the Silver Crystal that yes I do think it was Queen Serenity's Sailor Crystal and that she was most likely a Sailor Moon at one point. I also think that all members of the Moon Matriarchy have the power to make manifest the Silver Crystal. That being said they can only do so usually when the previous person has sort of past down their Sailor Senshi power to them. Which is why Queen Serenity couldn't transform into Sailor Moon during her time as Queen of the Silver Millennium that we saw and why Neo Queen Serenity couldn't transform into Sailor Moon anymore and with Chibiusa as the new Sailor Moon. I believe Tsundereshipper also theorized that Sailor Chibi Moon wasn't the Sailor Senshi of Our Moon like her mother was but some Pink Moon. That is clearly nonsense as for one Chibiusa is said to be the next generation Sailor Moon and if she is not the Sailor Senshi of our Moon then during Crystal Tokyo there wouldn't be a Senshi of our Moon anymore as Neo Queen Serenity can't transform anymore.

Once more Usagi herself after she is Neo Queen Serenity will most likely become Sailor Cosmos so I suppose since she is no longer Sailor Moon The Cosmos Crystal will Merge with her own.
The problem with this theory is that it contradicts Naoko's own lore that she created during the Dream & Stars arcs - that every star/celestial object has it's own Star Seed which physically manifests into a Senshi/Sailor Crystal carrier that is that star's guardian. Each Senshi's Star Seed/Sailor Crystal is uniquely their own and they can never truly die nor pass on their Sailor Crystal because if they do then they'll either become soulless husks or simply returned to the Galaxy Cauldron - therefore I fail to see how the same Star Seed/Sailor Crystal can exist at the same time sustaining two different Senshi - one is either the Senshi of the Star or they're not, there doesn't seem to be any grey area. The only way to make sense of all this and make fit with the earlier arcs mechanics is basically what Saberblade proposed right here:


Okay, just spit-balling ideas for the moment. Suppose that the reason we never saw Queen Serenity transform isn't because she never could, but because she couldn't anymore. Recall that Neo Queen Serenity was formerly Sailor Moon, and that she could no longer transform after becoming queen, as though becoming queen (or king, in Mamoru/Tuxedo Mask/Endymion's case) was some form of retirement for a Sailor Senshi. Likewise, Queen Serenity was already queen by the time we first see her, so she would have already been retired from being the Moon's Sailor Senshi by that point.

Regarding the Silver Crystal being an heirloom of Moon royalty vs. just Usagi's star seed/Sailor Crystal, it is strongly implied that the Silver Crystal Usagi has is the same one that had belonged to Queen Serenity, with Usagi having inherited from her following the fall of the Moon Kingdom and Usagi's reincarnation on 20th Century Earth. But then, when we get the whole thing with Sailor Crystals and star seeds later, that calls into question both the uniqueness of the Silver Crystal and how it could have passed from Queen Serenity to Usagi if it was supposed to have always been tied to one or the other like a star seed is supposed to.

Well, recall that Queen Serenity didn't reincarnate on Earth with those who did, and, as has been mentioned above, Princess Serenity didn't seem to have her own crystal at the time that her mother owned the Silver Crystal, hence why she inherits it when reborn on Earth as Usagi. Most assume that Usagi's inheriting the Silver Crystal is why the queen wasn't reborn too; that she sacrificed her rebirth for that of her daughter's by passing on her crystal to Usagi. But then, that comes back to the question of why Princess Serenity didn't have her own crystal. Simply put, because she didn't need one at the time. The Moon Kingdom was at peace, the queen had the most powerful crystal at her disposal, and the princess had four guardian Sailor Senshi to protect herself. She didn't need a crystal of her own at the time.

But, that isn't necessarily to say that she didn't actually have a crystal of her own. Like what's been said above, the Dream arc had the Senshi acquire their Sailor Crystals not simply by being physically given them, but becoming aware of them, having their presence made manifest before them. Likewise, Princess Serenity may have always had a Sailor Crystal of her own within her, but because she was still just a princess and never fully awakened or trained as a Sailor Senshi (never needing to due to the aforementioned peace and protection she had), her crystal never manifested to hers or anyone's awareness. In other words, her star seed never showed itself to be a Sailor Crystal.

It is possible that Queen Serenity was also not aware of the possibility of her daughter having her own crystal either, since it never manifested itself, and thus she passed on her own Silver Crystal to her daughter, sacrificing her own chance at rebirth for her daughter. And because the princess's crystal never manifested itself, the queen's Silver Crystal must have kinda overrode or maybe even merged with the princess's/Usagi's star seed, making what was once her mother's now her own. Its later evolution into the Silver Moon Crystal was then the final step in making it fully Usagi's and no longer her mother's.

In addition to all of that, Chibiusa also had a Silver Crystal of her own that manifested itself from within her during the final battle with Death Phantom/Nemesis, awakening herself as a Sailor Senshi. It is a separate crystal from that of Usagi/Sailor Moon/Neo Queen Serenity, but is still called the "Silver Crystal" just like her mother's. This separate second Silver Crystal later evolves into the Pink Moon Crystal, making it fully Chibiusa's and no longer resembling the one that belonged to her mother. This then suggests that the Silver Crystal is an heirloom in a more metaphorical sense that the original literal meaning, as if to say every princess of the Moon's royal family is born with a star seed that will manifest itself as a Silver Crystal upon each princess's awakening as a Sailor Senshi, and which may later evolve into a new form that is unique to each Sailor Senshi Moon Princess.

And when each princess assumes the throne and becomes queen, they essentially retire from being a Sailor Senshi and can no longer transform, but still possess the fighting power of their crystal, which by this point may in turn revert back to its original "Silver Crystal" form during the queen's reign. But in the unique case of Princess Serenity, she never became a Moon Senshi so her crystal never awakened within her, so her mother passed on her own at the cost of her life and rebirth, not knowing the dormant potential of her daughter's own star seed and instead giving her own for Usagi to use as Sailor Moon, since it was already so powerful and Usagi would need to defend herself sooner than later against an enemy so powerful that the queen could only seal away rather than destroy outright.

Otherwise, had Princess Serenity awakened as a Sailor Senshi back in the Moon Kingdom, she may indeed have manifested of her own from her star Seed instead of never doing so and being given her mother's in her reincarnated life.

However it is interesting with Akari@ria that I heard that interpretation as well. That the scene we saw in the manga didn't happen prior to Princess Serenity's birth nor was Queen Serenity going to the Cauldron the Impetus for her birth but happened after the fall of the Silver Millennium and Queen Serenity went to I guess throw herself into the Cauldron and allow her Crystal to fully merge with her Daughters to give this "shell of a star" new life. I don't know which interpretation is more accurate IE that Queen Serenity came to the Cauldron before hand and due to the Power of the Cauldron conceived and bore Princess Serenity or she came after her daughter was born and after the fall of the Silver Millennium to throw herself into the Cauldron to give her Daughter new life. It would be interesting of the latter was true because unlike the 90s anime I don't believe we ever saw how Queen Serenity died. She obviously did so as I believe her spirit was in the Moon Computer but how she did so was not shown to my knowledge nor was it shown the reason why she died.
Honestly the fact that Queen Serenity was never reborn was what made me doubt she was ever a Senshi/Sailor Crystal carrier. It's heavily implied that only those with Sailor Crystal Star Seeds are able to be reincarnate, while those with only regular Star Seeds cannot. I thought this was always the reason why we don't see the Cats come back to life at the end of the manga, I want to believe it wasn't just a careless oversight on Naoko's part and was just her trying to stay consistent with her own established lore.
 

MariaTenebre

Systema Solare
Jul 22, 2009
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#74
Tsundereshipper it is implied that Sailor Senshi have unique Starseeds with their planets but it is also stated that Sailor Senshi can pass on their powers usually through a child to someone else. Their Sailor Crystals remain special but once they sort of transfer their power they cease to be Sailor Senshi like with Neo Queen Serenity and she is implied to become Sailor Cosmos later. So while Chibiusa may become Sailor Moon later on her Mother will become Sailor Cosmos.

Likewise I am sure the Cats will be back to life at the end of Sailor Stars they are too important and do appear in Crystal Tokyo. Likewise it is shown that people can be reincarnated without having a Sailor Crystal. Beryl and the Shitennou of the manga canon are perfect examples of this as unlike in the 90s anime they weren't sealed away within the North Pole but were reincarnated with Beryl finding the North Pole and the Dark Kingdom again and meeting the Shitennou who each had new reincarnated lives now. This might even apply to Phantom Ace/Danburite too,
 

Tsundereshipper

Lumen Cinererum
Jun 17, 2019
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#75
Likewise it is shown that people can be reincarnated without having a Sailor Crystal. Beryl and the Shitennou of the manga canon are perfect examples of this as unlike in the 90s anime they weren't sealed away within the North Pole but were reincarnated with Beryl finding the North Pole and the Dark Kingdom again and meeting the Shitennou who each had new reincarnated lives now. This might even apply to Phantom Ace/Danburite too,
Oh that's true, I forgot. I guess I was always just subconsciously applying Queen Serenity's wish & sealing from the 90's anime onto the manga (doesn't she even mention in the Dark Kingdom arc of how "she sealed them all away?") and thus felt like those reincarnations after the fall of the SilMil "didn't count" and was more just an exception rather than the rule.
 
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MariaTenebre

Systema Solare
Jul 22, 2009
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#76
Oh that's true, I forgot. I guess I was always just subconsciously applying Queen Serenity's wish & sealing from the 90's anime onto the manga (doesn't she even mention in the Dark Kingdom arc of how "she sealed them all away?") and thus felt like those reincarnations after the fall of the SilMil "didn't count" and was more just an exception rather than the rule.
I think it was more complex then that. I believe she sealed the castle of the Dark Kingdom itself and Queen Metalia but Beryl and the Shitennou were killed and thus not sealed away alive as they were in the 90s anime. Beryl for instance was stabbed by Sailor Venus and how the Shitennou died I didn't know so yes I think that those without Sailor Crystals can be reincarnated.
 
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Tsundereshipper

Lumen Cinererum
Jun 17, 2019
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#78
I think it was more complex then that. I believe she sealed the castle of the Dark Kingdom itself and Queen Metalia but Beryl and the Shitennou were killed and thus not sealed away alive as they were in the 90s anime. Beryl for instance was stabbed by Sailor Venus and how the Shitennou died I didn't know so yes I think that those without Sailor Crystals can be reincarnated.
Now that I think about it further, I'm pretty sure non-Senshi really can't reincarnate and the only reason Beryl, Shittenou and Ace did in the manga was because like in the 90's anime, Queen Serenity's sealing allowed this one exception.

The reason why I think so is not just because of the Cats, but look at what happens to characters like Ace & Beryl once they're killed in their second life. They never come back. Even the Shittenou can't come back either and are just reduced to being rocks.
 
Sep 13, 2009
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#79
Yeah, since Naoko hadn't yet come up with the idea of the Star Seeds at the time, I think it was implied that all those who died in the Moon Kingdom's fall and were reincarnated on Earth in the 20th century were reincarnated by Queen Serenity's own power.

Guess she was indiscriminate in her choosing who got a second chance at living (maybe she'd hoped the Dark Kingdom members would make better life decisions and choose a different, much better path in their second life, not knowing that Beryl, at least, would choose to return to her evil ways.)
 

MariaTenebre

Systema Solare
Jul 22, 2009
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#80
Now that I think about it further, I'm pretty sure non-Senshi really can't reincarnate and the only reason Beryl, Shittenou and Ace did in the manga was because like in the 90's anime, Queen Serenity's sealing allowed this one exception.

The reason why I think so is not just because of the Cats, but look at what happens to characters like Ace & Beryl once they're killed in their second life. They never come back. Even the Shittenou can't come back either and are just reduced to being rocks.
The Cats will be back. I mean they are necessary in Crystal Tokyo for the timeline to have Diana.

Likewise Queen Serenity's sealing only worked to seal Queen Metalia. Beryl the Shitennou and Ace were reincarnated. I mean even for the Shitennou they are alive in the end as rocks.

I think anyone who would assume that the Cats wouldn't be back would be silly. As they are alive in the Crystal Tokyo we saw in the future.