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Sep 25, 2021
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#1
Pet peeves as a Sailor Moon fan? Misconceptions are allowed, too.

My main one is when people are inconsistent with the names, especially with the names of the Senshi. "I ship Usagi and Mercury." "My favorite Senshi are Neptune and Lita." "I think Ami and Serena have the cutest dynamic." Like, WTF???!!! Y'all, STAAHHP!

Also when people say that Sailor Moon is a crybaby who always needs Tuxedo Mask to save her. Or that the show's sexist for not having male Senshi. Or who say that Rei is a bad friend to Usagi despite them having the deepest bond in the series(they're one of my ships, now! :3). Or who say that Luna and Artemis are freaks into bestiality...umm...Finally, people who say that any other Magical Girl show is a rip-off of Sailor Moon. I'm a general Magical Girl fan. Please don't throw my other beloved shows under the bus. You can stan PreCure, CCS, TMM, LoliRock, and the rest AND Sailor Moon. You don't need to [BLEEP] on either. This trend of hating on women/female-dominated or -centric shows to prop up other ones sucks. Criticism is one thing, but this...nah fam.

I could say more but I'm tired. I may edit this post or reply to it like a lonely person would. I think.

So, whatever. List yours here.
 
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With Sousuke Sagara
#2
People who try to interject politics and religion in the show. How certain fans have their own cliques. Also, as for the whole dub vs sub thing I’ve found it easier to use the terms Sailor Scouts and their old dub names when talking about the old dub and to use the terms Sailor Guardians and their original Japanese names when talking about anything from Japan.
 
Jun 17, 2019
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#3
Mixing the Optimum dub and original names in fics, I have nothing against the old dub and have a soft spot for it myself, but when fic authors do this it makes it hard to tell whether the fic is based on dub continuity or the original. And yes it matters, because contrary to popular belief, the old dub and original Japanese are two very different universes. If I’m specifically looking for a fic set in the original Japanese universe then it’s past the “kissing cousins” Amara and Michelle. Are they actually Amara and Michelle in this fic who are just cousins and nothing more? Or are they unrelated lesbian lovers Haruka & Michiru and the author is simply mixing dub names due to nostalgia? Consistency people.
 
Jul 6, 2018
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#4
The way this franchise seems cursed. We have to wait for ages to get anything new. Crystal has been goingon for like 8 years and will take a at least decade by the time Stars happen. We were promised artbooks we never got, a color manga that is suddenly never mentioned. The old show could never be seen in proper hd because materials are not available. And then... The inconsistency in all its anime history. I have seen a ton of shows from the 80s and 90s and I rarely see something with such drastical art changes from episode to episode. It then happened with Crystal in an era it almost never does anymore.
 

Lady Pen

Luna Crescens
Mar 12, 2021
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#5
The way this franchise seems cursed. We have to wait for ages to get anything new. Crystal has been goingon for like 8 years and will take a at least decade by the time Stars happen. We were promised artbooks we never got, a color manga that is suddenly never mentioned. The old show could never be seen in proper hd because materials are not available. And then... The inconsistency in all its anime history. I have seen a ton of shows from the 80s and 90s and I rarely see something with such drastical art changes from episode to episode. It then happened with Crystal in an era it almost never does anymore.

I think once the Kanzenban was released a new artbook featuring old illustrations wouldn't be profitable. Keep in mind that almost all of them have been overused in many products. They might've changed their minds.

However, the full colour manga would be a great opportunity to release more merchandise with printed panels, the characters posing and countless pin-ups on it. They''ll have many panels to choose.
 
Sep 25, 2021
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#6
People who try to interject politics and religion in the show. How certain fans have their own cliques. Also, as for the whole dub vs sub thing I’ve found it easier to use the terms Sailor Scouts and their old dub names when talking about the old dub and to use the terms Sailor Guardians and their original Japanese names when talking about anything from Japan.
I feel like there CAN be room to discuss such political stuff in the show such as its representation of women, LGBTQ+ people, etc., and its handling of weight loss in episode four was indeed very poor, namely because it makes teenage girls look like naive clueless idiots who desperately want to lose weight to be pretty, and even ridiculed the one fat girl who didn't even have a name! I don't like the DiC dub, but at least it gave her a name: that being Lorraine. I heard that it could be an actual critique on diet culture, but it was still handled very poorly, and still managed to throw fat people under the bus. That being said, I feel like there should be a time and place to talk about these things. Alternatively, sometimes people talk about these things when it IS necessary and relevant to the discussion at hand, and other people who don't want to handle it whine and go "Why do you have to be so PoLiTiCaL about everything?!?!?!!?!" It really is a pick and choose.

The Sailor Scouts argument is also fair. I tend to use "Senshi" regardless because I just HATE the term Sailor Scouts. That's another pet peeve of mine! They're soldiers! Soldiers fight, Scouts sell cookies! Geez! It isn't that hard to understand, DiC! >:(
 
Sep 25, 2021
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#8
I know episode 4 was handled quite poorly, fat shaming is terrible and all, but I just love episode 31 and I feel bad about it, but it always makes me laugh.
Sus, but it makes me laugh, too! Especially the fishbone and ripoff Tuxedo Mask music!!!!! LOL!!!!
 

Rika-Chicchi

Staff member
Site Admin
May 7, 2009
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#9
I know episode 4 was handled quite poorly, fat shaming is terrible and all, but I just love episode 31 and I feel bad about it, but it always makes me laugh.
Its various details, micro plot developments/pacing are classic textbook materials for anime students. :cool:
 
Jul 22, 2009
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#10
Honestly with the weight loss issues on episode 4 people need to cool their jets. Especially now that we have the "fat positivity" movement in the West which is telling people especially women that you can be fat and obese and be healthy which is absolutely NOT true. Being fat andobese causes numerous health problems.

Plus more people in this nation die from obesity then anorexia or bulimia. I mean we even have fat homeless people.
 

Rika-Chicchi

Staff member
Site Admin
May 7, 2009
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#11
Honestly with the weight loss issues on episode 4 people need to cool their jets. Especially now that we have the "fat positivity" movement in the West which is telling people especially women that you can be fat and obese and be healthy which is absolutely NOT true. Being fat andobese causes numerous health problems.

Plus more people in this nation die from obesity then anorexia or bulimia. I mean we even have fat homeless people.
Yeah, having a big size or being plump is one thing (I actually like that), but obesity is a (both personal & public) health issue.
 
Jul 22, 2009
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#12
Yeah, having a big size or being plump is one thing (I actually like that), but obesity is a (both personal & public) health issue.
Well again I think that curvy and buxom women of the Fertility Goddess build is the look I find most beautiful and glamorous in women myself but as you admitted there is a huge difference between that and being fat or obese.
 
Jul 6, 2018
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#13
Well again I think that curvy and buxom women of the Fertility Goddess build is the look I find most beautiful and glamorous in women myself but as you admitted there is a huge difference between that and being fat or obese.
Yes, people tend to go overkill it a bit. Healthy is one thing, obesity cannot be healthy. But then it is not always by choice. It is really nice and positive to not make fun of these people - you don't know their medical history and why they look this way, but you shouldn't promote that as healthy either. This is another pet peeve of mine with Sailor Moon - when some Moonies say " The girls are so skinny, it is so bad for children. This is style this is drawing, at the age of 2 your child has enough brain to realize these are not human beings. At the same time the Hollywood criteria that are the actual possible problem don't change that much. No matter how many people come with the inspirational quotes - beauty is in all shape and sizes, most teen dramas still have the skinny protagonist and the fat girl is there for representation, usually in the background. It is a bit hyporitical to blame it on the cartoons
 
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#14
People who try to interject politics and religion in the show. How certain fans have their own cliques. Also, as for the whole dub vs sub thing I’ve found it easier to use the terms Sailor Scouts and their old dub names when talking about the old dub and to use the terms Sailor Guardians and their original Japanese names when talking about anything from Japan.
This! I don't want the mods sending any more of the aforementioned posts to the Cauldron! Real world political and religious rants have such nasty viewpoints and they don't have a place here!
 
Sep 25, 2021
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#15
Honestly with the weight loss issues on episode 4 people need to cool their jets. Especially now that we have the "fat positivity" movement in the West which is telling people especially women that you can be fat and obese and be healthy which is absolutely NOT true. Being fat andobese causes numerous health problems.

Plus more people in this nation die from obesity then anorexia or bulimia. I mean we even have fat homeless people.
I really don't think that's what anybody is saying. Simply that bigger bodies deserve appreciation and love, too! Nobody's saying "Feel free to sleep on the couch eating hamburgers and potato chips and drinking sodas while playing video games all day until the couch itself is begging for mercy! Because that's just BEE-YOO-TEE-FULL!!!!" Merely that not everyone has to be super rail-thin to be considered attractive. You could make the same argument for our society's worship of smaller figures that being anorexic doesn't make you healthy, because that's not true. Both cause health problems but it's important to have fat positivity because plus-sized bodies are not widely recognized as beautiful in society. Similar to why we have "Black is beautiful", because being Black isn't seen as beautiful due to the white beauty standard.

For me, personally, I'm quite tall, but I also have a very small frame. Weight wise, at least. When I wrap my index finger and thumb around my wrist, they overlap. I also have a very small hip/bust size. Both traits which have led to relentless bullying, whether this is by people saying "you're so tiny" while wrapping their index fingers/thumbs around my wrists, picking me up(or saying they could, which often led to them actually doing so), asking me if I eat(I eat quite a lot, thank you, probably more than them, I just have a high metabolism, that's all!), or mocking me for being flat-chested or not having a butt. This is especially common in the Black community, as having a curvier figure is the standard and prized there(and it's bad enough that I already "acted white"...). I was never ashamed of it(at least, not the latter), but I did wish the body shaming would stop because I felt humiliated.

But at the end of the day, being skinny is still the standard according to virtually every magazine, beauty commercial, Miss America/World pageant, and fashion catwalk ever. Trust me, I've watched them, and it's saddeningly rare to see even a slightly chubby woman on there. Even when you're supposed to be curvy, they still won't accept fat. The fashion industry loathes fat women. Even fat men loathe fat women. And significantly more women are starving themselves to be beautiful than stuffing their faces to be beautiful. That's why episodes like Sailor Moon's fourth episode hurt so much, especially in countries like Japan where being fat is even LESS accepted there! So excuse fat women if they want to have a movement dedicated to celebrating their bodies, because a big girl would likely have gone through worse than what I did. Being fat doesn't mean you have an eating disorder, plenty of fat people eat normally and healthily and, oh yeah, some people are just naturally fat. Yeah, we have fat homeless people, but we have anorexic homeless people too, and I'm pretty sure that's more common, for obvious reasons.
 
Sep 25, 2021
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#16
Yes, people tend to go overkill it a bit. Healthy is one thing, obesity cannot be healthy. But then it is not always by choice. It is really nice and positive to not make fun of these people - you don't know their medical history and why they look this way, but you shouldn't promote that as healthy either. This is another pet peeve of mine with Sailor Moon - when some Moonies say " The girls are so skinny, it is so bad for children. This is style this is drawing, at the age of 2 your child has enough brain to realize these are not human beings. At the same time the Hollywood criteria that are the actual possible problem don't change that much. No matter how many people come with the inspirational quotes - beauty is in all shape and sizes, most teen dramas still have the skinny protagonist and the fat girl is there for representation, usually in the background. It is a bit hyporitical to blame it on the cartoons
Yeah, the skinny ideal is everywhere. But then again, that is exactly why it hurts a lot of people to see this standard parroted on TV on every occasion. Also, I think you're giving two-year-olds too much credit. They literally only existed for two years. They barely know anything about society or how to combat the toxic messages they learn every day. And considering the fact that, if they're girls, then many of them will grow up to starve themselves and force themselves to vomit in order to stay pretty and slim, I would argue that they don't actually know that female characters in animation with body types like the Sailor Senshi or the Disney Princesses are just cartoons and "not human beings". And while cartoons can have obviously inhuman body types, that is typically not what goes on with female characters. Typically, they are made to appeal to the male gaze by being stick thin yet also curvaceous. Especially in shows where the men have a variety of body shapes but the women are all uniformly small and cutesy and docile.

And when the vast majority of media buys into this infantilizing yet ridiculously sexualizing beauty standard, it's not a coincidence that animation will do the same. If anything, the fact that they don't have to mirror real life because you can design them however you want actually furthers allowing them to feed into cultural misogyny and fatphobia. If the ideal woman is unrealistically skinny, and animation models aren't real people, then to hell with making a realistic female character! Throw that out the window and make her as small as you want! That's clearly what motivated the Inner Workings creators. And kids will pick up on it. They'll see it, and a lot of them will think "this is what is attractive. This is what I need to look like to be pretty." And since that body type is impossible to achieve normally, or at all, they resolve to getting rid of their insides to meet this standard as closely as possible. So I think it's understandable to complain about body types in Sailor Moon or any animated media in general, whether that be Disney Princesses or super heroes. And why I think "they're just cartoons so they're not meant to imitate life" isn't an excuse.

However, let's not try too hard to derail this thread. Back on topic, I think another pet peeve of mine is when people downplay the relationship between Haruka and Michiru, especially when they do so by making one of them(usually Michiru, because you know, if you're feminine then you MUST be into boys, since femininity only exists for the male gaze!) bisexual, often as an excuse to break the couple up and pair her up with a guy in fanfics. I once saw a Tumblr post from a straight woman(because of course it was) saying that she saw Haruka and Michiru as just really close friends, just because her heterosexual younger self couldn't wrap her mind around two girls in love...fortunately everybody called her out on it, but still, this is why I HATE Death of The Author. I literally only see it used either to downplay/erase progressiveness in a work or ignore/erase problematicness in a work. And it infuriates and disgusts me. Why are people like this?!
 
#17
I really don't think that's what anybody is saying. Simply that bigger bodies deserve appreciation and love, too! Nobody's saying "Feel free to sleep on the couch eating hamburgers and potato chips and drinking sodas while playing video games all day until the couch itself is begging for mercy! Because that's just BEE-YOO-TEE-FULL!!!!" Merely that not everyone has to be super rail-thin to be considered attractive. You could make the same argument for our society's worship of smaller figures that being anorexic doesn't make you healthy, because that's not true. Both cause health problems but it's important to have fat positivity because plus-sized bodies are not widely recognized as beautiful in society. Similar to why we have "Black is beautiful", because being Black isn't seen as beautiful due to the white beauty standard.

For me, personally, I'm quite tall, but I also have a very small frame. Weight wise, at least. When I wrap my index finger and thumb around my wrist, they overlap. I also have a very small hip/bust size. Both traits which have led to relentless bullying, whether this is by people saying "you're so tiny" while wrapping their index fingers/thumbs around my wrists, picking me up(or saying they could, which often led to them actually doing so), asking me if I eat(I eat quite a lot, thank you, probably more than them, I just have a high metabolism, that's all!), or mocking me for being flat-chested or not having a butt. This is especially common in the Black community, as having a curvier figure is the standard and prized there(and it's bad enough that I already "acted white"...). I was never ashamed of it(at least, not the latter), but I did wish the body shaming would stop because I felt humiliated.

But at the end of the day, being skinny is still the standard according to virtually every magazine, beauty commercial, Miss America/World pageant, and fashion catwalk ever. Trust me, I've watched them, and it's saddeningly rare to see even a slightly chubby woman on there. Even when you're supposed to be curvy, they still won't accept fat. The fashion industry loathes fat women. Even fat men loathe fat women. And significantly more women are starving themselves to be beautiful than stuffing their faces to be beautiful. That's why episodes like Sailor Moon's fourth episode hurt so much, especially in countries like Japan where being fat is even LESS accepted there! So excuse fat women if they want to have a movement dedicated to celebrating their bodies, because a big girl would likely have gone through worse than what I did. Being fat doesn't mean you have an eating disorder, plenty of fat people eat normally and healthily and, oh yeah, some people are just naturally fat. Yeah, we have fat homeless people, but we have anorexic homeless people too, and I'm pretty sure that's more common, for obvious reasons.
Thank you!
 
Jun 17, 2019
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#19
Honestly with the weight loss issues on episode 4 people need to cool their jets. Especially now that we have the "fat positivity" movement in the West which is telling people especially women that you can be fat and obese and be healthy which is absolutely NOT true. Being fat andobese causes numerous health problems.

Plus more people in this nation die from obesity then anorexia or bulimia. I mean we even have fat homeless people.
Yes, people tend to go overkill it a bit. Healthy is one thing, obesity cannot be healthy. But then it is not always by choice. It is really nice and positive to not make fun of these people - you don't know their medical history and why they look this way, but you shouldn't promote that as healthy either. This is another pet peeve of mine with Sailor Moon - when some Moonies say " The girls are so skinny, it is so bad for children. This is style this is drawing, at the age of 2 your child has enough brain to realize these are not human beings. At the same time the Hollywood criteria that are the actual possible problem don't change that much. No matter how many people come with the inspirational quotes - beauty is in all shape and sizes, most teen dramas still have the skinny protagonist and the fat girl is there for representation, usually in the background. It is a bit hyporitical to blame it on the cartoons
This is one area the old DIC dub actually improved in. They changed the message of this episode from problematic fat-shaming concerning unrealistic beauty standards for women into more having to do the importance of healthy eating habits for health rather than just to look beautiful.
 
Jul 6, 2018
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#20
This is one area the old DIC dub actually improved in. They changed the message of this episode from problematic fat-shaming concerning unrealistic beauty standards for women into more having to do the importance of healthy eating habits for health rather than just to look beautiful.
This is true. But I have my pet peeves about something that is not yours and change it. Even if you might improve on certain aspects, very few in Dic's case, but you haven't created this product - it is not your to change. Anyway these were the times, but I am against it as practice - if you find this thing that problematic, create something better from scratch.